Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 69,920   Posts: 1,522,036   Online: 951
      
Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst 1234
Results 31 to 38 of 38
  1. #31
    JBrunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    6,780
    The "purity" of digital "photography" is to me, pedantic. It is what it is, many times closer to design that incorporates images, than photography. So, no, I don't view it really as photography, but more of a Frankenstien of variously combined, and continually mutating technologies. It can be "art", but it is not hand made art, created by craft, with a rich tradition of teaching and history, and that is all the difference to me.

    For me, the greatest revelation, the most work, was when I learned when not to make a negative. I shoot far fewer holders than I use to. I do not ever struggle with a mediocre negative trying to make it ok, trying to make it rise above mediocrity. I try to make a negative that sings, and then a print that rises beyond that. If I can't, I just walk away, and save wasting my time. I learned that by watching a true master and mentor.

  2. #32
    raucousimages's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Salt Lake
    Shooter
    Large Format
    Posts
    825
    For me the "Work" is in the preparation. Today I am shooting a portrait for a Christmas gift on 4X5. We have worked several hours planing this shoot but the more I prep now the less work I will need to do on the shoot and in the darkroom.
    DIGITAL IS FOR THOSE AFRAID OF THE DARK.

  3. #33
    Michel Hardy-Vallée's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Montréal (QC)
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    4,351
    Images
    132
    Jason, I take your point because while I agree that there is a distinction between the type of things that works of arts are, and what they are not, I'm not sure about our traditional separations between the arts.

    I do think there is some distinction between a painting and a novel, just like there is one between red and blue, but the problem that a principled distinction would face is that we can have an infinite number of intermediary cases (you know there will always be artists clever or obstinated enough to prove wrong any sort of separations!), just like the color spectrum progresses gradually.
    Using film since before it was hip.


    "One of the most singular characters of the hyposulphites, is the property their solutions possess of dissolving muriate of silver and retaining it in considerable quantity in permanent solution" — Sir John Frederick William Herschel, "On the Hyposulphurous Acid and its Compounds." The Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, Vol. 1 (8 Jan. 1819): 8-29. p. 11

    My APUG Portfolio

  4. #34
    JBrunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    6,780
    Quote Originally Posted by mhv View Post
    Jason, I take your point because while I agree that there is a distinction between the type of things that works of arts are, and what they are not, I'm not sure about our traditional separations between the arts.

    I do think there is some distinction between a painting and a novel, just like there is one between red and blue, but the problem that a principled distinction would face is that we can have an infinite number of intermediary cases (you know there will always be artists clever or obstinated enough to prove wrong any sort of separations!), just like the color spectrum progresses gradually.
    If something is art or not, is completely separated from process, and I think that allot of people go astray at that point in these discussions. If its printed in a darkroom on fiber, or painted on a canvas, that hardly qualifies anything as art. Nor is something that has seen the inside and assistance of a computer disqualified as art. It doesn't help that the amatuer side is at this point, blissfully ignorant of photographic craft. Art and craft are distinctly separate things, anyone remotely familiar with the two processes can see that digital imaging and traditional photography or whatever semantic one wants to use are distinctly separate crafts. Some persons try to fool themselves and others, for a variety of reasons, and it is also a soft transition, from digital to hybrid to traditional as you pointed out.

    The point is that art has nothing to do with it, and never has.

    I do find it interesting that nobody seems to obfuscate, and rename traditional work so as to make it appear to have a digital pedigree.

    But I do think this is off topic, and as I said, wholly pedantic. Those who percieve no difference, wont. They don't want to.
    Last edited by JBrunner; 12-07-2006 at 06:17 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  5. #35
    Daniel_OB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Mississauga, Canada
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    420
    Robopro
    I am happy there are still people like you, and I am also happy not a lot of people like you. Photography, when it comes to art consideration, is the most difficult medium at many points. Like always and anywhere, camera owners always try to make it less painfull finding every kind of shortcuts to results in desire to produce even several works of art weekly. Arguing with them is useless, especialy over internet.
    www.Leica-R.com

  6. #36
    Michel Hardy-Vallée's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Montréal (QC)
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    4,351
    Images
    132
    A topical example of the problem I was trying to raise regarding photography is the reaction to Lasse Gjertsen's sampling work. Someone on APUG posted the link a while ago, and today it is on the front page of Slashdot.

    Here you have someone who does not have "traditional" instrument-playing skill (just like many photographers can't draw) but who nevertheless produces music (just like a photographer makes a picture).

    The threads on Slashdot show that Gjertsen's work challenges common notions of what a real musician because he does not have instrument-playing skills, even though he understands composition, harmony, melody and rythm.

    Of course that's the same issue that occured with the piano, the synthesizer, the sampler, the computer-generated series of music, etc. But it's a case that illustrates the recurring unease we have when medium-specific skills are sidestepped, and that forces us to question what we really consider to be artistic talent.

    Another item of contention on the value of his work was the fact that people have been sampling for ages. Some have argued that in fact it's the addition of video that makes it more interesting.
    Using film since before it was hip.


    "One of the most singular characters of the hyposulphites, is the property their solutions possess of dissolving muriate of silver and retaining it in considerable quantity in permanent solution" — Sir John Frederick William Herschel, "On the Hyposulphurous Acid and its Compounds." The Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, Vol. 1 (8 Jan. 1819): 8-29. p. 11

    My APUG Portfolio

  7. #37

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,670
    Quote Originally Posted by Ole View Post
    The difficult thing is seeing the picture in the first place.
    There is another side to this which now prevents me from destroying any negatives. Often, years later, I will see the photograph that my subconcious saw when I took the picture. (Immediately afterwards, my concious mind may not see anything worthwhile in the negative.) So the entire process can take many years.

  8. #38
    Ole
    Ole is offline
    Ole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Bergen, Norway
    Shooter
    Large Format
    Posts
    9,280
    Blog Entries
    1
    Images
    31
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerald Koch View Post
    There is another side to this which now prevents me from destroying any negatives. Often, years later, I will see the photograph that my subconcious saw when I took the picture. (Immediately afterwards, my concious mind may not see anything worthwhile in the negative.) So the entire process can take many years.
    That's what I consider one of the best things about LF: There are so many fewer negatives, and so much better chance that you actually saw what you took a picture of - and not just thought you might have seen something.
    -- Ole Tjugen, Luddite Elitist
    Norway

Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst 1234


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin