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  1. #21
    snegron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shmoo View Post
    Sometimes the only thing you learn from people like that is how NOT to be like that.

    S
    I totally agree with this statement! I guess that the only positive side of dealing with those rude photographers is that it develops a feeling of empathy toward beginning photographers. I am always very careful of what I say and how I say things to people who ask me for either advice or opinions. The way I see it, new photographers have a certain degree of either respect or admiration for you when they ask for your opinion or advice. They trust what you tell them. Why insult them or hurt their feelings? As far as I'm concerned it is not up to me to "toughen them up" or "thicken their skin". If a person is determined to succeed, he or she will do so regardless of any ill treatment. I would rather be remembered in a positive way when they do succeed instead of "that jerk photographer" who was mean to them when they were first starting out.

  2. #22
    tony lockerbie's Avatar
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    A new member turned up to our photo club the other night and was inspecting some of my prints and made a comment that they looked like darkroom prints. They are indeed, I said, to which she replied... Oh my god! There are people still doing wet prints.. time for you to move on. I did.
    Tony

  3. #23
    roteague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snegron View Post
    Funny how that never happened with the F3 throughout its 20 year production life.
    You mean that it was not bashed, or not a piece of junk? I had an early model F3, and went through 3 circuit boards in its life span; I didn't bother to fix it after the last time. It was junk.
    Robert M. Teague
    www.visionlandscapes.com
    www.apug.org/forums/portfolios.php?u=2235

    "A man who works with his hands is a laborer; a man who works with his hands and his brain is a craftsman; a man who works with his hands and his brain and his heart is an artist" -- Louis Nizer

  4. #24
    David H. Bebbington's Avatar
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    I remember hearing a talk from Grace Robertson, a very charming lady who at the age of 19 or so became a "Picture Post" magazine staffer with the legendary Kurt Hutton as a mentor. His way of "criticizing" any work he felt was below standard was to rip it to shreds and jump up and down on it while screaming at the unfortunate GR, who I think nonetheless had the objectivity to realize that KH's problem in this case was of a psychosexual rather than photographic nature.

  5. #25
    braxus's Avatar
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    I guess the closest thing to this would be going to a photography club here in BC that turned me sour. I went for a few months, and later just gave up on the whole club. A few did talk to me as a new member, but for the most part mostly everyone else left me alone and didn't even bother to get to know me when I was there. Everyone had their little click. You'd figure you'd be welcomed to the group being a new member, and people would ask you about your past with photo. That wasn't the case. I couldn't shoot as much as their contests required me to, so I figured it was best to stop going. I won't list the club since a member from there may be on here.

  6. #26

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    The trick to dealing with such people is to refuse to indulge in reverence. I think the minute one assumes that the person passing the verdict has some kind of absolute authority, you are relinquishing the very independence of thought that is surely essential to being your own photographer. I remember sharing and exhibit with a digital photographer who was a key member of hi local club. He told me how pleased he was that the local 'god' from his club was coming down and that I would do well to talk to him. The creature finally appeared, complete with favourtite plastic bag and cherished 30 year old coat and proceeded to walk about looking at our work with a look of seriousness and professionalism that was entirely out of keeping. I never did speak to him because he clearly thought I should approach him (despite the fact that it was my work on the wall) and his body language screamed 'I am the 'absolute authority' that puts newbies in their place'. I could not care less about his opinion at the time and could not care less now either. To get thru such encounters one has to let the inner confidence, even arrogance, come to the surface. Play it meek and the nasties will have you on strings, making the 'improvements' they desire and in creative terms you will gain nothing. Good teachers never make a pupil feel that way and are not insecure enough to need to make themselves feel better by ridiculing the work of others. Sadly, I think some camera clubs are the playground of those who themselves got bullied and were no good at sport i.e payback!

  7. #27

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    Back in college in my basic photo classes, I remember I was almost always subject to harsh unconstructive criticism and bashing from some of the fellow students and a few instructors. As I look back now, I believe that had a lot to do with their personalities. But what the heck, I had a much thicker skin than they thought I did, I guess.

  8. #28
    bjorke's Avatar
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    You want bad attitude?

    I just made myself watch the old Ayn-Rand-original-script THE FOUNTAINHEAD.

    I now realize that all the people who have every recommended it to me are deeply deranged.

    "What Would Zeus Do?"
    KBPhotoRantPhotoPermitAPUG flickr Robot

  9. #29
    Ed Sukach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Stanworth View Post
    ... He told me how pleased he was that the local 'god' from his club was coming down ...
    ... his body language screamed 'I am the 'absolute authority' that puts newbies in their place'. I could not care less about his opinion at the time and could not care less now either.
    Been there, done that - have the T-shirt.

    To get thru such encounters one has to let the inner confidence, even arrogance, come to the surface. Play it meek and the nasties will have you on strings, making the 'improvements' they desire and in creative terms you will gain nothing. Good teachers never make a pupil feel that way and are not insecure enough to need to make themselves feel better by ridiculing the work of others. Sadly, I think some camera clubs are the playground of those who themselves got bullied and were no good at sport i.e payback!
    My observations, exactly. I would eagerly join an organization that did NOT treat newcomers like this ... so far I haven't found one. Not to say they do not exist, but certainly the bully-free ones are rare.
    Carpe erratum!!

    Ed Sukach, FFP.

  10. #30
    Ian Leake's Avatar
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    A few years ago when I was a junior learning my "real job" I had the pleasure of being shouted at for 40 minutes by a Partner who was angry at me because he'd made a really bad mistake in front of the client. I learned a huge amount from this one, slightly traumatic, event. And it's helped me much more than I expected at the time - especially now that I'm a senior teaching others.

    There are "bad eggs" in every walk of life. When you encounter one (which you will), it's up to you to decide how to react. You can choose to listen and learn (i.e. don’t worry about what they’re saying, but ask yourself why they’re saying it), or you can allow yourself to get disillusioned and give up. The choice is yours.

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