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  1. #1
    davetravis's Avatar
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    So Easy, A Caveman Could...

    Well, after 4 years on the art show circuit, someone finally asked me the ultimate ignoramaus question!
    The following diaglog just happened today, and is accurate from the best of my recall:
    Mother with 13 year old daughter looking through my print bin: "So all these wildflowers in the front of this mountain, You added these in PS by stitching them?"
    Me: "No, this is real photography."
    (Mature gentleman also in my booth hangs his head"
    Mother: "The only reason I ask is that we have a Photoclub that uses PS to "stitch" together different parts of a nature scene and then print the photo."
    Me: "That's fake photography."
    (13 year old daughter hangs her head.)
    Mother: "I guess, but who knows the difference?"
    Me: "Anyone who cares."
    Needless to say, I didn't make a sell, but I hope the 13 year old will think about the future of "real photography."
    DT

  2. #2
    MikeSeb's Avatar
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    I understand your frustration Dave. I just hope you weren't too snarky, because from that the 13 yr old will mainly learn that artists are arrogant d**kheads.

    I'm sensitive about this issue, because I was treated very rudely once at a photographer's booth at a major national art fair held here yearly. His work was excellent, and I intended to buy something--I was the only visitor in his booth at the time. I asked him a question about his technique (I have 35 yrs of photographic knowledge under my belt so I'm no newbie), expecting an enthusiastic response from him, as I'd have given to a customer of my work were the roles reversed--joy of discussion with a knowledgeable person, etc--but his reply was so condescending and arrogantly stated that I walked out cursing him under his breath. I took great satisfaction in seeing on a repeat pass by his booth that it was STILL empty and his walls were STILL full.

    Maybe you missed a "teaching moment", when you could have gently enlightened the mom. Once aware of the superior value offered by your "real" images, you might even have made a sale.

    Continued success in your endeavors.
    Michael Sebastian
    Website | Blog

  3. #3

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    I love the way they use 'stitch', implying some degree of craftsmanship. Given the subtlety with which so many Photoshoppers work, 'nail' might be a better word.

  4. #4
    rwyoung's Avatar
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    I don't think that was rude at all. She started it! And obviously doesn't care enough to know the difference. Nothing wrong with WELL EXECUTED and APPROPRIATE (and there is the word that will cause trouble) application of PS. But knowing and appreciating the difference between a silver print (or PT or PL or VDB or whatever) and an amaturish PS knock off is what will keep "analog" alive!
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things! http://rwyoung.wordpress.com

  5. #5
    David Brown's Avatar
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    Oh, you just have to ignore these people. And maybe laugh at them under your breath.

    I've actually had people walk up to me while shooting, look at my Mamiya RB on the tripod, look down at the 3.4725 megadot thing hanging around their neck and walk off with an air of superiority.

    I mean, puhleeeze ... I have a 6 megadot in my camera bag ... :rolleyes:
    David
    Taking pictures is easy. Making photographs is hard.

    http://www.behance.net/silverdarkroom
    http://silverdarkroom.wordpress.com

  6. #6
    Lopaka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Brown View Post
    I've actually had people walk up to me while shooting, look at my Mamiya RB on the tripod, look down at the 3.4725 megadot thing hanging around their neck and walk off with an air of superiority.
    Yeah, and how often have you heard: "MY darkroom is in my den."?

    Somehow that makes the finished product better???:rolleyes:

    Bob
    "I always take a camera, That way I never have to say 'Gee, look at that - I wish I had a camera'" -Joe Clark, H.B.S.S.

  7. #7
    David Brown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lopaka View Post
    Yeah, and how often have you heard: "MY darkroom is in my den."?

    Somehow that makes the finished product better???:rolleyes:

    Bob
    Yeah!

    Or, no.

    I didn't mean to get into the analog-digi debate (and I don't think you did either, Bob), it's simply the snobbery from whatever source that always amuses me. And after years of being torked off, I have finally managed to react with amusement now. I got the same thing in the music business, where I used to hang around with a lot of church organists. They constantly debated the relative merits of different organ builders (not to mention the pipe/electronic [analog/digital?] debate) while never demonstrating that they themselves could actually play worth a darn.

    But I do understand and sympathize with Dave Travis' frustration.

    ILLEGITIMI NON CARBORUNDUM
    David
    Taking pictures is easy. Making photographs is hard.

    http://www.behance.net/silverdarkroom
    http://silverdarkroom.wordpress.com

  8. #8
    davetravis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeSeb View Post
    I understand your frustration Dave. I just hope you weren't too snarky, because from that the 13 yr old will mainly learn that artists are arrogant d**kheads.

    I'm sensitive about this issue, because I was treated very rudely once at a photographer's booth at a major national art fair held here yearly. His work was excellent, and I intended to buy something--I was the only visitor in his booth at the time. I asked him a question about his technique (I have 35 yrs of photographic knowledge under my belt so I'm no newbie), expecting an enthusiastic response from him, as I'd have given to a customer of my work were the roles reversed--joy of discussion with a knowledgeable person, etc--but his reply was so condescending and arrogantly stated that I walked out cursing him under his breath. I took great satisfaction in seeing on a repeat pass by his booth that it was STILL empty and his walls were STILL full.

    Maybe you missed a "teaching moment", when you could have gently enlightened the mom. Once aware of the superior value offered by your "real" images, you might even have made a sale.

    Continued success in your endeavors.
    Thanks Mike!
    I understand your sensitivity, I've met a few like that.
    The truth is, some artists on the show circuit are arrogant pompous asses, but most aren't.
    I'm not even sure if I'm an "artist," I call myself a "professional camper."
    Talking to hundreds of folks for 2 or 3 days, we can't be all things to all people.
    Sometimes you just gotta tell it like it is, and roll with the flow.
    In the spirit of the moment, all was lite-hearted, and humorous.
    The mom took my card and wanted to know if I did workshops.
    The daughter acted like a normal teenager, she blushed.
    The mature gentleman, bought my largest piece off the wall.
    Now off to Pueblo Lake and bass fishing!
    DT

  9. #9
    Daniel_OB's Avatar
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    davetravis
    [I]Well, after 4 years on the art show circuit, someone finally asked me the ultimate ignoramaus question!
    The following diaglog just happened today, and is accurate from the best of my recall:
    Mother with 13 year old daughter looking through my print bin: "So all these wildflowers in the front of this mountain, You added these in PS by stitching them?"
    Me: "No, this is real photography."
    (Mature gentleman also in my booth hangs his head"
    Mother: "The only reason I ask is that we have a Photoclub that uses PS to "stitch" together different parts of a nature scene and then print the photo..."



    Typical for today image culture acting, and is incurable. What is to them difference between original Rembrandt and cheap print? None at all. To them no difference in just anything, not just photographs and dig** print.
    I have the same problem as davetravis. But I have to accept that I must to learn how to recognize that two-legs creeping creatures or I am gone. It is very special method of market research today for professional photographers. Market for portrait photography looks large but it is not truth. One has to deal with “kind of people” and to make tight selection right at the door of the studio, or the place where to advertise the job. The point is, at this moment, to learn how to recognize one that does not belongs to that hordes of stupidoses for whom there is no difference just in anything. Human being becomes so fast the largest pollution on this “small” planet.
    When I am sure it is one of them I find no tolerance, just get rid sh** off the tent or studio ASAP or stink can spread. Even what some potential customer told me is that he will skip photographer he knows he mix with just anybody. So many people knows what is going on today.
    I go to large food market, once to cheap, next time to the most expensive. I analyze people at both and find a large difference. One going to walmart will never-ever deep into his pocket for a nice photograph. However if I say what I noticed I can pick jail…

    It is all not nice by traditional dictionary, but again, if I am polite I am gone. Time changed and so I have to.

    www.Leica-R.com

  10. #10
    roteague's Avatar
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    Reminds me that I, a dedicated film photographer, spent the entire day yesterday in front of the computer doing Photoshop and Lightroom (doing stuff for my website).
    Robert M. Teague
    www.visionlandscapes.com
    www.apug.org/forums/portfolios.php?u=2235

    "A man who works with his hands is a laborer; a man who works with his hands and his brain is a craftsman; a man who works with his hands and his brain and his heart is an artist" -- Louis Nizer

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