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  1. #11

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    I think you guys must have misunderstood what I stated on top. I am not the victim of a bad thread, rather I was wondering why there are quite a few threads in other forums where the topic goes way of course and becomes very personal. I am amazed that the offended parties do not just stop sharing their experiences and knowledge.

    Oh and I do not really mind dust ups but if it gets personal then that is something else. I find these kind of biases are better sorted out face to face.
    Francesco

  2. #12
    Eric Rose's Avatar
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    If you mean Pn, that's the reason I spend very little time there. As with any playground there are always bullies to be found.

    I just ignore them. But then again sometimes it's fun to bait them and then watch the bloodletting.

    Francesco you sound like a really decent guy and I for one am glad you contribute to APUG.

    Eric
    www.ericrose.com
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    "civility is not a sign of weakness" JFK

    "The Dude abides" - the Dude

  3. #13
    Jorge Oliveira's Avatar
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    Pn?
    Poto.net is a very quiet and civilized place.

    Take a look at rec.photo.darkroom when it's really heated!

    (-:

    Jorge O

  4. #14
    Eric Rose's Avatar
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    PN has settled down quite abit in the last 4 months after they banned a bunch of the real bad ones.
    www.ericrose.com
    yourbaddog.com

    "civility is not a sign of weakness" JFK

    "The Dude abides" - the Dude

  5. #15
    bmac's Avatar
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    Now if only they could keep their site running. The current setup is a total joke. Thank god Sean knows how to tweak and optimise APUG.
    hi!

  6. #16
    Eric Rose's Avatar
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    In all fairness I would suspect PN gets several orders of magnitude great traffic than APUG. But having said that Sean is a true wizard.
    www.ericrose.com
    yourbaddog.com

    "civility is not a sign of weakness" JFK

    "The Dude abides" - the Dude

  7. #17

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    Maybe (to oversimplify) some people
    a) Like a good fight or
    b) are just a__holes?

  8. #18
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    If you can't stand the fire, get out of the kitchen, I say.

    Posts like "I like it!" or "gorgeous!" are useless and don't lead anyone anywhere (and are NOT a valuable incentive, if they are freeely distributed everywhere capriciously). Critical comments like "that sucks" are certainly not much better, though useful for the moderators (?) as a means to identify troublemakers.

    But if there's some thought process behind it, then everything else, IMO, is FAIR GAME. Just be willing to back up your assertions with something better than "well that's what I think, nyah"

    If active debate and dialectic was good enough for Socrates, Aristotle, and Marx, it should suffice here.

    "What Would Zeus Do?"
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  9. #19
    Ed Sukach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bjorke
    If you can't stand the fire, get out of the kitchen, I say.
    Posts like "I like it!" or "gorgeous!" are useless and don't lead anyone anywhere (and are NOT a valuable incentive, if they are freeely distributed everywhere capriciously).
    But if there's some thought process behind it, then everything else, IMO, is FAIR GAME. Just be willing to back up your assertions with something better than "well that's what I think, nyah"
    If active debate and dialectic was good enough for Socrates, Aristotle, and Marx, it should suffice here.
    Sorry to "tag" so much of that previous statement. I would like it to be kept in focus while I engage in active debate.

    To follow the above "rigid requirement" that comments such as "I like it" or "gorgeous" (both of which I will admit to having written, many times) is to accept a limitation of expressing one's honest reaction to a photograph. What WOULD be proper, if the honest reaction is one where an intense emotional response needs a description of the effect caused by encountering a unique, touching, emotion-filled photograph?
    I have seen photographs that have drawn me into their aura, caused tears, have hypnotized me into another universe...., have re-kindled feelings of great joy, fascinated me to a state of rapture. These should be described as - what? "Could be improved by ...", when I cannot honestly conceive of any "improvement" whatever? I consider that to be plainly, and simply, dishonest.

    Comments like "Awesome" ARE useful. Why should we deny anyone who asks, the recognition of their GOOD effects upon us? This conforms to the old idea of "never let them know when they have succeeded - it will only make them lazy" -- a mechanism designed solely to discourage others and protect the lofty turf of the discourager.

    There. That should provided some fertile ground for discussion and debate.
    Carpe erratum!!

    Ed Sukach, FFP.

  10. #20
    blansky's Avatar
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    Ed:

    I don't know about fertile ground. This is simply a repeat of your comments on the thread about critiquing as well as another thread. It's been covered over and over.

    It is the opinion of others here, that even if one is magically delivered to another universe or tranformed in a state of perpetual rapture, it still doesn't help the person asking to be critiqued to be showered with just this message.

    I know, you are an empowerer. Everything is great. It's so original. Don't mess with their little egos. They may be damaged for life.

    But let me put another spin in it. Don't you think that your gushing over everyone and everything will actually lead them to tune you out as a serious critiquer (is that a word), because in essence they learn nothing from you. With every situation they get the nice pat on the head and sent on their way.

    As many have already said, a critique is a pointing out of the positive and the negative aspects they feel is present in a photograph. No serious critiquer savages a print or a person. They instead offer a critical, thoughtful and informative appraisal of the work.

    I will however agree some photographs are awesome, and some are overpoweringly great. But they are rather rare.


    Michael McBlane

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