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  1. #41
    David A. Goldfarb's Avatar
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    Does it matter? Bad people sometimes produce good work, and good people often produce bad work.
    flickr--http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidagoldfarb/
    Photography (not as up to date as the flickr site)--http://www.davidagoldfarb.com/photo
    Academic (Slavic and Comparative Literature)--http://www.davidagoldfarb.com

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Sukach
    Quote Originally Posted by Andre R. de Avillez
    My prejudices should not be the basis for anyone else's actions/opinions. This does not go for myself alone, but for everyone else as well.
    But what if I WANT them to be the basis for my opinion? It is entirely possible that what you have said in your opinion does have a significant effect - and I will start to think differently.
    Then use my prejudices at your own risk :-)

    I always put a disclaimer by my comment; I've found that it's better to be safe than sorry

  3. #43
    bjorke's Avatar
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    Callow, I suggest you consider the paradox inherent in the concept: "selflessly devoted to their art"

    their art?

    "What Would Zeus Do?"
    KBPhotoRantPhotoPermitAPUG flickr Robot

  4. #44
    jd callow's Avatar
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    Boy has this thread been educational. I learned that all those hundreds of hours studying 1000s of works of art across the epoch of humankind and the 10s of thousands of words written about them by what I thought were some of the greatest minds was a waste of time. The Art no better than Avedon, and the words, copious elitist quasi-intellectual masturbation.

    Wow, To think whilst I was learning about a culture’s rise and fall by studying their art I could have been selflessly defending the hobbyists privilege to expose film (however imperfectly), Just like Mikey and make boatloads of money to boot.

    The saddest thing I learned was what a crass waste of a life it is to be devoted to art. Here I thought I was trying to record something of significance, add some value, but all I was doing was being selfishly devoted to myself.

    God I hope my wife doesn’t find out.

  5. #45
    David R Munson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcallow
    ...and the words, copious elitist quasi-intellectual masturbation.
    Glad I could be of service.

    While I may rail against art society a fair amount, I still believe in the concept of fine art and the arts in general. There is nothing wrong with devoting one's life to art - what bothers me is the pretentious attitude and assumed superiority that comes along with it. Maybe I'm just extra-aware of it because I'm mostly involved in commercial applications of photography, but there is a definite bias against commercial work in much of the fine art community. I can understand where people are coming from sometimes, because there is some pretty worthless commercial work out there. But there's also commercial work that is every bit as valid from the standpont of fine arts as straight up "fine art" photography. It just happens to have a secondary purpose. The fact that one makes money off of an image in no way negates its artistic validity, as I see it. I remember a few years back someone relating on one of the Photo.net forums hearing an art critic on NPR criticizing a Boston art museum for having a show of Herb Ritts' work because, as far as the critic was concerned, a commercial photographer has no place in a museum of fine art. That is the sort of thing that pisses me off.

  6. #46
    Leon's Avatar
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    Apug really does my head in sometimes (to coin a colloquial english phrase)! It's only opinions - does it really matter? There are way bigger fish to fry.

  7. #47
    Juraj Kovacik's Avatar
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    If you know how badly I envy you the fact, that you can live with photo all your life. Why do you think that somebody can assume that making money by .. analysis, for example ... is better then making money by taking pictures of children or making photo for add? And if somebody DO this assumption, ask him for what he is paying for.

    A life of a "weekend photographer" is usually split in two uncomplementary parts what could be fine for study of schizophrenia but what doesn't look as the best way how to find a satisfaction, regardless what your definition of satisfaction is. I really don't think there is something you have to complain about.

    And btw, hockey World champion is going in Prague and I hope for Saturday's final match Slovakia against USA (tomorrow is semifinal match Slovakia - Canada). And I'm afraid that could be source of new frustration for you, Michael, because we are going to beat you. JK

  8. #48
    KenM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jurajk
    And btw, hockey World champion is going in Prague and I hope for Saturday's final match Slovakia against USA (tomorrow is semifinal match Slovakia - Canada). And I'm afraid that could be source of new frustration for you, Michael, because we are going to beat you. JK
    Sorry, you've got it all wrong. Canada vs USA in the final on Sunday.

    I'm afraid you're the one who'll be frustrated :-)

    Cheers!

    -klm (who's trying to lighten the atmosphere around here)

  9. #49
    Juraj Kovacik's Avatar
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    Dear Ken, hold your dreams while you can. They are going to be finished tomorrow... Canada is a nice country, how one can see on www.acanadianplace.com, but you forgot how to play a good hockey. Tomorow you will have a lesson so you can learn something...



    .. only joking, hope it would be a good game... JK

  10. #50

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    All this hockey talk is offensive. I do not think this site should be used to promote blood sports
    Technological society has succeeded in multiplying the opportunities for pleasure, but it has great difficulty in generating joy. Pope Paul VI

    So, I think the "greats" were true to their visions, once their visions no longer sucked. Ralph Barker 12/2004

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