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  1. #51
    zsas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lbenac View Post
    Almost all if not all vendors that have had this issue reported that PayPal sided toward the Buyer. Some of these sellers are forum members that I would trust without any hesitation.

    About what? Goods that didn't show up? Or item not described?
    Last edited by zsas; 12-28-2011 at 01:09 PM. Click to view previous post history. Reason: Added quote
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  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by zsas View Post
    Or item not described?
    Item not described. As long as you can ship with signature, delivery confirmation and tracking you are likely safe on the non delivery.
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  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by zsas View Post
    If you sell an item and the buyer pays via "goods" then both are protected. So if you follow the rules (ship tracked, to their address, confirmed if over $250 (US policy, different amts may apply per country), abd the buyer claims to have never received the item, yet you have this proof, how would you not be protected against buyer fraud? I don't believe Paypal would return the payment so long as you followed the terms (ie Seller protection).
    It has happened to me twice that buyers (Chinese) tried to get "a little discount" by inventing all sorts of damage and by abusing paypal's buyer protection. 'Seller protection' didn't help me a single bit to defend against that. I don't think highly of seller protection, and I'd be happy to toss it in exchange for no protection at all for either side. But that would hurt sales and make ebay & paypal earn less. It's not more complicated than that.

    Seller protection means nothing to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by zsas View Post
    Your issue seems to be the terms are more expensive to implement bc TNT is not sig delivery proof via online?
    It's not the reason why I started this thread, but yes, it is an issue that complicates the paypal process (for me).

    Being in a small country in Europe it's inevitable that most of the things I sell end up in forgein postal systems, where tracking and signature aren't always guaranteed.

    But that's not the main issue here. The reason for starting this thread is me wanting to know how paypal works outside ebay. I now know a lot more than before the start of this thread. The thing I don't yet understand is the role of credit card companies. How much power do they have? Do their rules always override those of paypal? What kind of deals exist between paypal and the credit card companies? Those are the sort of questions that I would like to see answered by someone knowledgeable.

    Quote Originally Posted by zsas View Post
    If a buyer claims the item wasn't described as advertised and claims that...well that is a different matter that is evaluated in a case by case basis, it isn't fair to say the Seller will always lose the dispute.
    Sorry but I never said that, nor did anybody else in this thread.
    Last edited by sandermarijn; 12-28-2011 at 01:53 PM. Click to view previous post history. Reason: typo

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by zsas View Post
    About what? Goods that didn't show up? Or item not described?
    A malicious case of 'item not as described' is impossible to defend against, thanks to paypal's seller/buyer-protection scheme.

    The seller can ask to have the item returned and undo the transaction, but if customs are in between this is not a cheap solution. And there is always the issue of who pays for the cost of shipping (either direction).

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