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  1. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFlyingCamera View Post
    The vibration is caused by the impact of the mirror slapping into the frame of the body when you release the shutter. It is present in the Hassy, obvious in a Pentax 67, and non-existent in a Rolleiflex (or any other TLR). It is most problematic at the slow end of the hand-holdable shutter speed continuum- between say 1 second and 1/15th, maybe up to 1/30th. Faster than that, there isn't enough time for the vibrations to record. Slower, and they fail to record as well because they don't last long enough. Oddly, the lack of sharpness they cause will be more noticeable when the camera is on a tripod. Hand-held, your hand is more likely to induce softness by its inherent instability than the mirror slap is.
    I don't know about that? I tested my 500C/80mm f2.8 years ago and I could see(with a loupe) a minute difference between mirror-up on a tripod and just shooting normal at 1/60th of a second. At 1/125th second things seemed to even out. I would still not worry at 1/60th since the difference was so small, but I don't like going below that if I can help it. If the picture is important and I do have to go slower a tripod+mirror-up is used. Just me of course! I do the same when I shoot with the Pentax 67. I'll admit I can hand-hold at much slower shutter speeds with the Rollei due to the way it's held and braced with a neck strap, but I still use a tripod if the shot is worth it. JohnW

  2. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFlyingCamera View Post
    ... Oddly, the lack of sharpness they cause will be more noticeable when the camera is on a tripod. Hand-held, your hand is more likely to induce softness by its inherent instability than the mirror slap is.
    Interestingly (or not), my experience has been just the opposite. The Hassy "vibration" is mitigated somewhat for me with a monopod and entirely with a tripod. When handheld I'm never really sure if the unsharpness is due to mirror slap or regular hand tremor. I find that when shooting lower speeds handheld it is easier to be successful with a TLR than a Hassy SLR, but that may be partly due to weight and shutter release design differences.

    Edit: or in other words... what JW just said.
    Last edited by BrianShaw; 10-31-2013 at 10:08 AM. Click to view previous post history. Reason: added comment

  3. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by BrianShaw View Post
    Interestingly (or not), my experience has been just the opposite. The Hassy "vibration" is mitigated somewhat for me with a monopod and entirely with a tripod. When handheld I'm never really sure if the unsharpness is due to mirror slap or regular hand tremor. I find that when shooting lower speeds handheld it is easier to be successful with a TLR than a Hassy SLR, but that may be partly due to weight and shutter release design differences.

    Edit: or in other words... what JW just said.
    Yup, but maybe that's just us Brian! I do know I am blessed with tremors + a inner-ear balance/equilibrium problem and that's another excuse to use a tripod. I still think that had I not developed these problems that the outcome would be the same. I do know, that for me the heavier the better for hand-holding. Within reason of course. JohnW

  4. #54
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    RE: Quick loading. it's certainly quicker to change the magazine on a Hasselblad than to load a Rollei, but re-loading that magazine with film is another matter. My Rolleiflex 2.8E is the easiest-loading medium format camera I own and the only one I can load while it's hanging from a neck strap.

  5. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Marvin View Post
    RE: Quick loading. it's certainly quicker to change the magazine on a Hasselblad than to load a Rollei, but re-loading that magazine with film is another matter. My Rolleiflex 2.8E is the easiest-loading medium format camera I own and the only one I can load while it's hanging from a neck strap.
    Yes, I do agree with the ease of loading a Rollei, but it's even easier to load the old "pre-feeler" Rollei's. Also, the plus side for the Hasselblad with swapping backs is in the use of the Zone System for B&W photography. I know the "so called" Zone System isn't as popular as it was a few years back, but some folks still adhere to it like Christens to the New Testament. If you have three backs you load them all with the same film (already tested for your own ISO/EI and Normal development) and label them as N-1, N and N+1. Pick your scenes, expose and then develop the roll according to the label on the back. Can't do that with a Rollei! I'll admit that I have not used this in years, but did at one time use it with Tri-X and HC-110 dilution B and it worked near perfect. Of course at that time I was using only Ilford Ilfobrom Grade #2. Now, I just get my exposures right and development right then VC paper takes care of the rest. JohnW

  6. #56

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    It seems like the effect of mirror slap would be emphasized if the tripod is close to its weight limit or the head is a little bit dodgy, but not if it's overbuilt for the camera in question. I'm just thinking from first principles here, but basically the question is whether that little amount of force will cause anything in the camera/head/legs chain to move, and obviously the answer is yes if there's some play in the linkage.

    Handholding makes it virtually impossible to distinguish between mirror slap and other sources of movement, of course.

    -NT
    Nathan Tenny
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    The lady of the house has to be a pretty swell sort of person to put up with the annoyance of a photographer.
    -The Little Technical Library, _Developing, Printing, And Enlarging_

  7. #57
    Fast's Avatar
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    I wonder some times if this is a forum about photography, or if it's a foram for people to "show off" about their knowlege of cameras. Everyone here wants to have the "last word" because they think their last word is the best. Throw out your ego-compitition, and go take pictures.

  8. #58

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    I feel compelled to ask at the risk of seeming offensive... but what part of that comment was useful to the discussion. If you have no interest in this topic, why not heed your own advise?

  9. #59

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    Every forum is for people to "show off" their knowledge. It's called "discussion". Nobody is honestly trying to win a pissing contest.

  10. #60

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    Years ago, when my brother was actually selling Linhofs and Rolleis, a favorite sales trick was to put an SL66 right down on the sales counter
    (no tripod involved), balance a dime on end atop it, and trip the shutter. The dime didn't even budge. If I tried that trick with my Pentax 67,
    even using the mirror lock, the dime would probably go flying as far as a slot machine in Las Vegas. Even with later Rollei MF SLR's the whole mirror/shutter operation seems remarkably smooth, if that happens to be your prime criterion. I mention that stipulation, because whenever
    we went out shooting together, he preferred to borrow my Pentax.



 

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