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  1. #31
    StoneNYC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattKing View Post
    Sorry Stone:

    Kodak's primary developer recommendations (see f4016 and f4043) for TMax 100 and TMax 400 are exactly the same: T-Max, T-Max RS, X-Tol, X-Tol (1+1), D-76, D-76 (1+1), or Duraflo RT, with no preference between those choices. There is also a partial recommendation (due to speed loss) for HC-110 (B), Microdol-X and Microdol-X (1+3).

    All currently available major developers were either originally designed with T-grain films being considered, or have been adjusted to perform well with T-grain films. To not do so would be folly.

    Developers do differ, but those differences are subtle and essentially differences of preference, not absolute suitability.

    If you like what DDX does for you, I'll support you 100% in your decision to use it. It is an excellent choice.

    As is ID-11/D-76.

    As an example, in contra-distinction, HC-110 (B) or Microdol-X would not be as excellent a choice with T-Max 400 if your goal was to maximize speed. If a small loss in effective speed does not concern you, then HC-110 (B) or Microdol would also be an excellent choice with T-Max 400
    Everywhere I've ever read has said that tmax developer and DD-X were specifically designed to work with t grain films... And it said so on the ilford website (I didn't look up kodak because I don't use it) but I can't reference every place I read that of course, thought quoting the ilford site would be good enough.

    (PS I just opened this app on my phone and realized I never sent this, from last night when I typed it... So not sure what's been written since, this may be old news, I won't know till I send it and can look... Hah! Technology for the win!).
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  2. #32
    Chris Lange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StoneNYC View Post
    Now you're just defending your wrong a statement with BS, some developers handle different types of grain differently, DD-X and Tmax dev as an example were DESIGNED to handle t grain emulsions ... And I just proved to you this by reference and you still refute it... Kodak says tmax dev is also designed for t grain film... So... :-p
    Quote Originally Posted by StoneNYC View Post
    Everywhere I've ever read has said that tmax developer and DD-X were specifically designed to work with t grain films... And it said so on the ilford website (I didn't look up kodak because I don't use it) but I can't reference every place I read that of course, thought quoting the ilford site would be good enough.

    (PS I just opened this app on my phone and realized I never sent this, from last night when I typed it... So not sure what's been written since, this may be old news, I won't know till I send it and can look... Hah! Technology for the win!).
    You aren't allowed to make statements like this without having any clue as to the science/chemistry behind the actual development process, which you have no interest in learning because you are also Jim Morrison.

    You are aware that Xtol and DD-X are extraordinarily similar in makeup, right? Both active ingredients are Phenidone and Hydroquinone. TMax developer also uses the same...Sprint Standard is also PQ, even though everyone thinks of it as D76 in a bottle.

    What they have in common is also their development via solvent action. Ever wonder why modern films look -especially- smooth when developed in these chemicals? It's because, in a nutshell, solvent developers soften the edges of grain in the negative, giving the appearance of a smoother image. D76 is a solvent developer too, I may add. Rodinal is not, thus its reputation for giving increased grain.

    Hell, Acufine, is PQ based and is regarded by many as being not ideal for use with D3200...

    Do you honestly mean to tell me that a mixture of chemicals in solution can intelligently decide whether a grain is triangular, hexagonal,cubic, or tabular? I have news for you, pal, T-grain doesn't mean jacks**t, Kodak's T-grain (tabular) are differently shaped than Ilford's Delta "Core-Shell" grains, which are differently shaped than Fuji's "Super fine-E Grain".

    Instead of quoting marketing literature and the top line of a tech-pub, maybe some actual research would benefit you.

    Now if we've finished our little pissing contest, I'd like to see what Rubyfalls' comes up with from his 645.
    See my work at my website CHRISTOPHER LANGE PHOTOGRAPHY

    or my snaps at my blog MINIMUM DENSITY
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  3. #33
    StoneNYC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Lange View Post
    You aren't allowed to make statements like this without having any clue as to the science/chemistry behind the actual development process, which you have no interest in learning because you are also Jim Morrison.

    You are aware that Xtol and DD-X are extraordinarily similar in makeup, right? Both active ingredients are Phenidone and Hydroquinone. TMax developer also uses the same...Sprint Standard is also PQ, even though everyone thinks of it as D76 in a bottle.

    What they have in common is also their development via solvent action. Ever wonder why modern films look -especially- smooth when developed in these chemicals? It's because, in a nutshell, solvent developers soften the edges of grain in the negative, giving the appearance of a smoother image. D76 is a solvent developer too, I may add. Rodinal is not, thus its reputation for giving increased grain.

    Hell, Acufine, is PQ based and is regarded by many as being not ideal for use with D3200...

    Do you honestly mean to tell me that a mixture of chemicals in solution can intelligently decide whether a grain is triangular, hexagonal,cubic, or tabular? I have news for you, pal, T-grain doesn't mean jacks**t, Kodak's T-grain (tabular) are differently shaped than Ilford's Delta "Core-Shell" grains, which are differently shaped than Fuji's "Super fine-E Grain".

    Instead of quoting marketing literature and the top line of a tech-pub, maybe some actual research would benefit you.

    Now if we've finished our little pissing contest, I'd like to see what Rubyfalls' comes up with from his 645.
    It's not even worth it...

    You're right oh all knowing one... Your logic is undeniable, you know more than the companies that creat them, you're able to scientifically prove that their marketing are all lies and propaganda with your giant brain of unfathomable knowledge...
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  4. #34
    Chris Lange's Avatar
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    You're misconstruing this. The point is that at the end of the day, it doesn't much matter which developer you use out of a group of very similarly formulated developers. And yes, I do know more than the marketing literature because I'm not in need of being marketed to because I took the time to actually learn what's going on behind the scenes. Tech sheets frequently use marketing literature as their front page...ever wonder why ilford chemicals always mention ilford films first? Dd-x points out Delta films initially? Don't be naive.
    See my work at my website CHRISTOPHER LANGE PHOTOGRAPHY

    or my snaps at my blog MINIMUM DENSITY
    --
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  5. #35
    MattKing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StoneNYC View Post
    Everywhere I've ever read has said that tmax developer and DD-X were specifically designed to work with t grain films... And it said so on the ilford website (I didn't look up kodak because I don't use it) but I can't reference every place I read that of course, thought quoting the ilford site would be good enough.

    (PS I just opened this app on my phone and realized I never sent this, from last night when I typed it... So not sure what's been written since, this may be old news, I won't know till I send it and can look... Hah! Technology for the win!).
    Stone:

    All general purpose commercial developers designed since the advent of "T-grain" films were designed to work well with T-grain films.

    And all general purpose commercial developers that were in existence prior to the advent of "T-grain" films have been modified (where necessary) to work well with "T-grain" films.
    Matt

    “Photography is a complex and fluid medium, and its many factors are not applied in simple sequence. Rather, the process may be likened to the art of the juggler in keeping many balls in the air at one time!”

    Ansel Adams, from the introduction to The Negative - The New Ansel Adams Photography Series / Book 2

  6. #36
    StoneNYC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattKing View Post
    Stone:

    All general purpose commercial developers designed since the advent of "T-grain" films were designed to work well with T-grain films.

    And all general purpose commercial developers that were in existence prior to the advent of "T-grain" films have been modified (where necessary) to work well with "T-grain" films.
    Fine, but that's what the documentation says, that DD-X was ESPECIALLY good for Delta... I dunno, whatever it's not worth it anymore, whatever I say is wrong no matter what.
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  7. #37
    MattKing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StoneNYC View Post
    ... I dunno, whatever it's not worth it anymore, whatever I say is wrong no matter what.
    Now this statement is indeed, wrong.

    Because there is lots of "rightness" in lots of what you say.

    And with all your posts, not surprisingly, there are significant numbers of times when you are completely right.

    When you do do "WRONG" however, you do it with energy!
    Matt

    “Photography is a complex and fluid medium, and its many factors are not applied in simple sequence. Rather, the process may be likened to the art of the juggler in keeping many balls in the air at one time!”

    Ansel Adams, from the introduction to The Negative - The New Ansel Adams Photography Series / Book 2

  8. #38
    StoneNYC's Avatar
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    Mamiya 645 pro TL and Delta 3200

    Quote Originally Posted by MattKing View Post
    Now this statement is indeed, wrong.

    Because there is lots of "rightness" in lots of what you say.

    And with all your posts, not surprisingly, there are significant numbers of times when you are completely right.

    When you do do "WRONG" however, you do it with energy!
    Haha! well at least I have enthusiasm
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  9. #39
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    I don't know, but I am enjoying this. And learning a lot. Or having a fantasy learning sequence montage where one goes from duh to ta-da during the course of 'Brown-Eyed Girl.' Hard to tell the difference.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  10. #40
    Chris Lange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rubyfalls View Post
    I don't know, but I am enjoying this. And learning a lot. Or having a fantasy learning sequence montage where one goes from duh to ta-da during the course of 'Brown-Eyed Girl.' Hard to tell the difference.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    If APUG had a "like" button for posts, I would use it on this.
    See my work at my website CHRISTOPHER LANGE PHOTOGRAPHY

    or my snaps at my blog MINIMUM DENSITY
    --
    If you don't have it, then you don't have it.

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