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  1. #21
    rfshootist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Lawton
    Even in a worse case scenario where 120 film is eradicated in ten years, and you are forced to scrap your MF system, the monetary loss will be substantially less than what the average digital shooter spends on upgrades over the same time period. In fact I think the fear of buying a camera due to future incompatablity in 10 years would be more pertenant to a potential DSLR buyer than a MF buyer. The average digital photographic enthusiast replaces a body every couple of years or so and dumps more money down the drain than someone who could no longer use a MF system.
    That's true indeed. But I am not one of the digital Joe Average lemmings who have accepted that from now on you have to replace your system every couple of years, investing an enormous amount of money each time.
    Where I come from (historically) you bought good stuff, took care of it , provided for adaequate maintainance and kept it for a lifetime.
    I still own a Cord my father bought used in the early 60s.

    Whatever will happen, the supply will last for 10 years more I suppose,
    another ten years more I can store in the freezer, enuff time to justify a 100% write off then.

    It was interesting to see that nobody here wanted to agree to the forecast of some of those "insiders" who say 120 will be in troubles first.

    Reagrds,
    Bertram
    A la recherche du temps perdu: www. bersac.de

  2. #22
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    I wouldn't worry too much.
    Today you can still get all sorts of film formats:
    8mm, 16mm, APS, 35mm, 110, 120, 126, 127, 620, 70mm and sheet film in sizes from 6.5x9cm to 20x24".

    Of course, some of them are not made by the major manufacturers any more, and the amount of films produced doesn't really matter if you don't like them

    I doubt 120-film will dissapear any time soon. Film, besides the visually pleasing appearance, still have quite a few technical benefits compared to digital. Wide-angels, shift and tilt is a problem with digital cameras, Depth-of-field at the same field-of-view is a problem (crop factor), digital has lower dynamic range, has highlight-clipping, and larger film formats have more detail than digital, analoge prints have more depth than ink-jet, tonal range in BW-film is typically a lot better and some films are many times as sharp as any digital camera of the same format (for instance gigabitfilm).

    Also,
    If you buy a medium format camera with exchangeable backs you can always fit a digital back later - or sell it to someone who would. I have a rolleiflex 6000-series camera and even ten years ago you could get digital backs for those and modern digital backs are still made for it. Rollei also sells a digital bundle and so does Hasselblad and Mamiya.

    If you follow the digital path, you will most likely have bought many cameras or digital backs before 120-film is gone.

    *imho*

  3. #23
    rfshootist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cvik
    I wouldn't worry too much.
    If you follow the digital path............
    Not as long as I can somehow avoid it . Maybe I'd rather give up photo and would learn to paint then !! :-))
    Bertram
    A la recherche du temps perdu: www. bersac.de

  4. #24

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    Clearly none of us have a crystal ball on this but I figure medium format film will be commonly available for up to about ten years, but it will become increasingly expensive and the number of emulsion options will be very limited.

    At this time image quality available from medium format equipment is still significantly greater than what is possible with the best digital prosumer equipment, even medium format equipment with digital backs. In about five years I expect that to have changed, which won't matter to some people here but it will likely put an end to the production of medium format film cameras.

    Stocking up on film and storing it in the freezer is an option, of course, but bear in mind that film, especially those with high ASA, will continue to increase in B+F from cosmic rays even when frozen. Based on my experience I would predict on average an increase of about log 0.45 over a ten year period for films such as TMAX-400, HP5+ and Tri-X.

    Sandy

  5. #25
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    Just my thoughts
    A couple things will keep MF going. Sales of MF film (whoo hoo big surprise), and sales of motion picture film. The latter may have a bigger influence then the former.

    The sale of MF cameras may have less to do with film than the direction of digital. If one body can be used for many backs -- as mf cameras can now -- than they may benefit from the the accelerated digital market place. Would you spend 5-8k every couple years on a top end DSLR if your existing body could accept the latest digital back? This assumes the the MF backs will be similar in price and or higher in quality.

    If I were to guess, I would give 120 colour a slow death of 5-10 years. I think B&W 120 will last considerably longer or for my lifetime.

    If digital capture becomes the standard in the movie industry, then movie stock will disappear and (colour) roll film will follow fast.

    *

  6. #26

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    The way I understand it the big issue with 120 is the backing paper. So few companies make it. Which makes me wonder why they aren't pushing 220 more.

    On the movie issue. US cinemas are balking at the cost of the change over. How long until every little place around the world changes over? I bet even if they shoot on digital they'll end up printing some on film.

    On the colour/b&w thing. The colour market is so huge I wonder if 99% of the colour market disappeared and only 50% of the B&W did which would be bigger?

  7. #27
    jd callow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Zentena
    The way I understand it the big issue with 120 is the backing paper. So few companies make it. Which makes me wonder why they aren't pushing 220 more.

    On the movie issue. US cinemas are balking at the cost of the change over. How long until every little place around the world changes over? I bet even if they shoot on digital they'll end up printing some on film.

    On the colour/b&w thing. The colour market is so huge I wonder if 99% of the colour market disappeared and only 50% of the B&W did which would be bigger?

    Nick you may be correct -- I was guessing. Except for the part about movie stock. This I was told by a guy who seemed to know his stuff.

    *

  8. #28

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    It just seems the colour market is so huge relative to the B&W market. In a way that's good. The B&W market has been small for years so maybe it'll manage better.

  9. #29
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    I was talking to the folks at my local camera store a couple of weeks ago about 120. They say they cannot sell it - the pros, who used to be their market, have switched to digital. They say that with the manufacturer set minimums they have to order, they may not order any more. They can't sell the minimum order before the film date expires.

    I would think that this means we'll be ordering 120 by mail, but that it will still be available for some time to come.

    Buy what you want for now - worry about the future when it gets here.
    juan

  10. #30
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    Yes, you pretty well have to take the situation as it is, and now worrry about the future. Markets change, so you may need to find other places to buy the film you want, but you will be able to get it.
    Robert M. Teague
    www.visionlandscapes.com
    www.apug.org/forums/portfolios.php?u=2235

    "A man who works with his hands is a laborer; a man who works with his hands and his brain is a craftsman; a man who works with his hands and his brain and his heart is an artist" -- Louis Nizer

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