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  1. #51
    Chazzy's Avatar
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    Yardkat, you mentioned interest in the Mamiya 7 without being able to afford one. To me that suggests you should consider the Koni-Omega and Rapid-Omega rangefinders. The prices are very reasonable for the bodies and lenses, and they are very rugged. You'll need an external light meter, but you probably have one anyway.
    Charles Hohenstein

  2. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul.A View Post
    2F/2F said "the people I know who prefer the Pentax are folks who are really pretty technically inept, intimidated by medium format, and prefer it's "big 35" look and feel. "

    Never considered myself as technically inept before, 25 years in the industry writing technical articles on photography, and now I'm considered technically inept because of the brand of camera I use. What a load of fucking bollocks.
    Some of my friends produce excellent images from Pentax 67s. Not sure how these 'technically inept' folks do it, but somehow they pull it off.

  3. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul.A View Post
    2F/2F said "the people I know who prefer the Pentax are folks who are really pretty technically inept, intimidated by medium format, and prefer it's "big 35" look and feel. "

    Never considered myself as technically inept before, 25 years in the industry writing technical articles on photography, and now I'm considered technically inept because of the brand of camera I use. What a load of fucking bollocks.
    Well, yeah... but he's young.

    I am sure after he's taken his 10,000th photo he will realize what we know. A camera is just a portable black box.

    Best of luck to you.

    tim in san jose
    Where ever you are, there you be.

  4. #54

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    "Never considered myself as technically inept before, 25 years in the industry writing technical articles on photography, and now I'm considered technically inept because of the brand of camera I use. What a load of fucking bollocks."

    It seems that a lot of the pissiness is coming from connotative understandings of words. When I say "technically inept", all it means is "technically inept". It doesn't mean "F-ing idiot incapable of producing anything worthwhile". I seem to have forgotten that this is an election year, so people will be pulling whatever sound bites suit their mood and taking them as complete statements. To make things more clear, here is the entire paragraph I wrote:

    "I thought I wanted a Pentax 67 as well when I had just started, but then I discovered RBs. In my experience, the people I know who prefer the Pentax are folks who are really pretty technically inept, intimidated by medium format, and prefer it's "big 35" look and feel. This in no way makes the Pentax a bad camera, nor does it mean these people don't produce outstanding work! There is just a bit of a different approach to using it, I think. Better suited for people who want the utmost in simplicity and ease of use, while the RB is better suited for those who are more interested in functionality, and versatility features."

    I didn't mean anything personal by it; honestly. I did not mean it as an insult to anyone. (Why on Earth would I?) I did not even state, nor did I imply, that being technically inept was a bad thing! In fact, I specifically stated otherwise. I did not call anyone technically inept except for people I personally know, nor did I say anything bad about those who use these cameras. If you have been writing technical articles for 25 years, then you should also be a good reader and not overreact to straight, plain, clear, and appropriately disclaimed language. It's the Internet. Don't be so sensitive. If you react this way to some post on the Internet, how do you walk down the street in town without suffering a nervous breakdown?

    As for Tim's comments, just let me have my sarcastic moment in response and state that I have taken more than 10,000 actually, and I have done it on many cameras that truly are black boxes. Also, I spent my "youth" running a nuclear reactor for the country instead of learning photography (as did you, with different specifics, of course), so I will thoroughly dispute your use of age and inexperience against me. (If I hadn't actually spoken with you, it probably would not bother me that much.) IMO, age, number of exposures, or camera used has nothing to do with it, but energy expended does.

    This is not a gear bashing or person bashing tear that I am on. I think you know how I feel about all cameras being great tools and great fun. I was simply describing a difference in features between the cameras that makes the Pentax more suited to those who are technically inept. The Pentax is a more simple and less featured camera, which the technically inept people I know prefer over an RB. Stating that the Pentax is well suited to those who are technically inept is *not* the same as stating that only technically inept people use the Pentax. They are not even close to being the same statement.
    Last edited by 2F/2F; 08-29-2008 at 01:17 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  5. #55

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    I have owned Pentax 67II for some years, and although I don't consider myself technically inept, I'd agree with 2F/2F that it might appeal more to some people used to 35mm cameras. As opposed to the more down-to-the-photography-bones of the other MF cameras like RB/RZ or Hassie or even a Rolleiflex. When the P67 is used with the metering prism, it is a 35mm on steroids.

    Now I consider my affair with Pentax67II an important transition from shooting 35mm to using real cameras (both MF and LF).

    And technically inept people IMO can sometimes make better photos because their minds are not cluttered by the technicalities...
    Jiri Vasina
    www.vasina.net

  6. #56
    Michel Hardy-Vallée's Avatar
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    2F; what if I told you you were an idiot?

    We all know that "idiot" comes from the latin "idiota", meaning a common person, a laymen. So it's a simple way to describe many of us here: laymen, amateurs, enthusiasts, etc. We're all idiots.

    Of course, nobody would ever be offended by that.
    Using film since before it was hip.


    "One of the most singular characters of the hyposulphites, is the property their solutions possess of dissolving muriate of silver and retaining it in considerable quantity in permanent solution" — Sir John Frederick William Herschel, "On the Hyposulphurous Acid and its Compounds." The Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, Vol. 1 (8 Jan. 1819): 8-29. p. 11

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  7. #57
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    Eddy McDonald
    www.fotoartes.com
    Eschew defenestration!

  8. #58
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    Well, I am for sure an idiot, and probably technically inept as well. (See the winky face? My tongue is in my cheek and I'm being lighthearted! yay!) I think I'm going to order a Pentax. I went to a local repair/store that had an RB for sale, and I have to say, I know they're all big, but the RB was just ginormous. I know the Pentax is big, too, but I was just turned off by the mamiya. I'm not even sure exactly why, truth be told. But I'm going to wait until next week, because I need to make sure about a couple other things before I whip out my much abused charge card. ;0

  9. #59

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    I fail to see where etymology comes into this. I am talking about current uses of the words "inept" and "idiot", not their roots.

    ...and, the real point: *I never called anyone here any of those words*, nor would I, nor did I state or even imply that being technically inept was a bad or shameful thing. I referred to it as a factual state of being of many of my personal friends, and that is it. Please read what I actually wrote.

    Both cameras are fine. The Pentax is just more simple and less full featured. The only reason I mentioned this is that some people I know (who shall remain without description) prefer it exactly for this reason. If you find something good, go with it...and don't worry about how technically adept or inept you are.
    Last edited by 2F/2F; 08-29-2008 at 07:50 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  10. #60
    Michel Hardy-Vallée's Avatar
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    2F, my point is simply that there is no escaping the usage of words, regardless of what the correct meaning is.

    Nobody really uses "inept" in except as a slur. Even though it does not mean it exclusively.
    Using film since before it was hip.


    "One of the most singular characters of the hyposulphites, is the property their solutions possess of dissolving muriate of silver and retaining it in considerable quantity in permanent solution" — Sir John Frederick William Herschel, "On the Hyposulphurous Acid and its Compounds." The Edinburgh Philosophical Journal, Vol. 1 (8 Jan. 1819): 8-29. p. 11

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