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  1. #11
    darinwc's Avatar
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    Above image was taken on a heavy tripod. Film is provia 400 iirc.
    Go not to the elves for counsel, for they will say both yes and no.

  2. #12
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    What shutter speed did you use? Did you use mirror lockup? How did you digitize the pix? Have you tried looking at them under a loupe and/or printing them optically?
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

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  3. #13
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    Judging from afar, photos look pretty flat. Did you use a lens shade? That cross lighting doesn't flatter the subjects very well either. I have 90 on my RB and mine seems to have more contrast.

  4. #14
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    What are you unimpressed with? Sharpness, contrast? Bokeh?

    Heavy tripod doesn't mean much at all; tripod coupling can be just as important as the actual weight of the tripod. Did you use MLU? Always use MLU on the RB if you can. Even on a heavy tripod, if your coupling is a bit dodgy, you can get some ringing that will not damp out quickly enough. Just now somebody will come on and say MLU doesn't matter, and thankfully I won't see it because he's on my ignore list, for good reasons. Use MLU. Be happy.

    I have the 90 KL and the 127 KL; I prefer the 127. I got the 90 just because I needed that exact field of view. I'd say the 127 KL is a tiny bit better all 'round, but just a bit. Likewise I have the 180 and the 210 KL apo and prefer the latter. But I am not one to do side by side tests, I simply use what I like.

    Oh and yes always use a shade, esp. if you are using pre KL lenses. Just now somebody will jump in with some idiotic comment about modern coatings not mattering, and again I won't see it because he's on my ignore list, but mark my words, use a freaking shade and then we'll talk If you don't shade, you are simply giving away contrast. Anyway, granted, the rb lens hoods aren't chic, they look like toilet plungers. But they are inexpensive and they collapse nicely. Get one for each lens and be happy.

    So: good tripod coupling. MLU. Shade. Happiness. If not, return the lens, and pick up a 127 KL. Even more happiness.
    Last edited by keithwms; 04-27-2010 at 05:28 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    "Only dead fish follow the stream"

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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Brown View Post
    I'll bet your focusing screen was off.

    That's very true.
    Everytime I find a film or paper that I like, they discontinue it. - Paul Strand - Aperture monograph on Strand

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2F/2F View Post
    I generally prefer a standard lens that is either slightly long or slightly wide when using the larger formats. For instance, a 105mm on 6x6, or a 210 or 240 mm on 4x5, or the 55mm on 645.
    You are probably shooting off the short side of the film.
    A 35mm frame is 24mm x 36mm.. 24mm * 2 = 48mm
    A 6x6 is 56mm x 56mm.. 56mm *2 = 112mm
    A 4x5 is 96mm x 120mm.. 96 *2 = 194mm

    All your prefered 'normal' focal lengths are about 2x the short side.
    Go not to the elves for counsel, for they will say both yes and no.

  7. #17
    darinwc's Avatar
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    "What shutter speed did you use? Did you use mirror lockup? How did you digitize the pix? Have you tried looking at them under a loupe and/or printing them optically?"

    I was shooting at f5.6, the shutter was on the fast side but I dont remember exactly what. I scanned them on an epson 700. I did not use mirror lockup. They look the same under a loupe.

    "What are you unimpressed with? Sharpness, contrast? Bokeh?"

    I dont know exactly.. I think sharpness.

    "tripod coupling can be just as important "

    The tripod was a bogen 3246 with a 3047 head.

    I allways use a shade on that lens.

    "Judging from afar, photos look pretty flat. Did you use a lens shade? That cross lighting doesn't flatter the subjects very well either. "

    I metered this one for the shadows, so it looks a little over-exposed. Thats why it looks flat. But that doesnt bother me since only shutterbugs will really notice. The light was a little harsh and unflattering.. I really need an assistant to hold a diffusion screen or a fill reflector =].

    *Most replies have been from users who own the C or KL model.

    Could this be close enough to require some close-range-correction? I was only about 4-5 feet away I think.
    Go not to the elves for counsel, for they will say both yes and no.

  8. #18
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    Yeah I think the 90 C probably should have a floating element. The 90 KL does have one. But that shouldn't affect center sharpness- it's mostly an edge sharpness issue when shooting wide open.

    Since there is no AF on the RB, you might think first about your focusing technique and GG and such. Maybe do some tests on a very high contrast subject.

    Definitely use MLU.
    "Only dead fish follow the stream"

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  9. #19

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    Jeff, the RB and lens system I refered to was new. I kept it for about 4 years, and made some good images with it. I'll repeat that the RB system is a great one. If you want the sharpest lenses possible (my particular taste) then I would not choose it again. I didn't try the KL variety of lenses, but I do understand they were better performers (re: edge to edge sharpness). I switched to an RZ, and found the lenses signifacantly sharper (to my eyes). My most recent project was shot primarily with an RZ and 110 mm (see my mannequin exhibit at luigipasto.com if you have a minute). I was very happy with it. I do agree that you absolutely need good technique as pointed out by Keithwms, with MLU and a heavy tripod a must. I use a sturdy Manfrotto 058 Triaut tripod. Again, the lens system on the RB is very respectable and can produce wonderful results. It was just not my cup of tea. In the end, any camera and lens combination can do wonderful things if guided thoughtfuly.

  10. #20

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    I agree with Keith, MLU makes a huge difference, especially with a less than optimum tripod/camera coupling. I for one have many of the C and non C lenses and have not found them lacking in any way.

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