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View Poll Results: Which choice would you make with limited funds?

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27. You may not vote on this poll
  • Wide-angle lens for RB67

    26 96.30%
  • BGN RZ67 bundle with 110mm f2.8 (and buy a wide-angle)

    0 0%
  • EX RZ67 bundle with 90mm f3.5

    1 3.70%
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  1. #31
    kodachrome64's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 23mjm View Post
    Maybe I missed this--BUT what does the RZ get you that the RB doesn't other than the ability to put a battery in the camera.
    In the long run it will be cheaper to get the high-quality RZ glass that I need (at least the ones I'm looking for). That was my main motivator - knowing that I need to buy a few lenses soon and found that the RZ lenses are cheaper in many cases. Other benefits of the RZ I have found:


    • Electronic shutters in lenses (more likely to get accurate exposure; mechanical shutters of RB lenses are a big variable)
    • One cocking/winding motion instead of two separate ones
    • A fast normal lens available (my work is not in studio)
    • Auto exposure available if desired
    • Can take RB lenses/backs (with adapter) if desired
    • Lighter, of course

    Those are just some of the benefits I've seen that would apply to me and how I use the camera. I can see being in a studio setting or being a repair guy preferring the all-mechanical operation of the RB. I've seen many people say that lenses are much cheaper for the RB, but I've found the difference to be the other way around for the ones I've been looking at (KL lenses vs the Sekor Z).
    Kodachrome
    They give us those nice bright colors
    They give us the greens of summers
    Makes you think all the world's a sunny day, oh yeah.
    -Paul Simon

  2. #32

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    There's an endless number of reasons the RZ is better than the RB. Hell, Mamiya made it as an upgrade/replacement for the RB - they didn't just do that for giggles. They thought it was better. (though I don't know why they continue to make the RB... nostalgia maybe?)

    Parts are still available for the RZ (plus its still being made of course) - parts for RB stuff is in shorter supply.

    Working on the RZ glass is just as easy as RB. I've had several of the lenses apart for various reasons, they are all quite straightforward so far. Certainly easier to deal with than any modern 35mm AF lens.

    Prices at KEH are generally a bit high overall, vs. what the open market will bear. They are a decent place to buy stuff but generally prices are cheaper on Ebay and elsewhere. KEH has a decent return policy though, so that's in their favor. And occasionally bargains do appear.

    Price-wise I think RZ and RB stuff has about bottomed. If anything it might go up someday(?!) if a full frame 6x7 digital back is ever invented.

    re: ease of use / unfamiliar camera - if you can figure out an RB, an RZ is easy. It has more interlocks so prevents more problems. Once you play with it a bit it will be quite familiar I think.

    Re: Mamiya 7 - that's a fantastic system too. In general I think the lenses are a touch sharper, but as mentioned the 50 ULD, 65 L/A, 110 on the RZ are all really damn fine. So are all the APO teles. I have been printing stuff from both systems the last few days, and overall it's hard to tell them apart, as far as sharpness. They aren't really a replacement for each other, since the RZ does a lot of things the 7 can't do: Close ups, telephoto, fisheye, tight headshots, motor drive, tilt/shift, etc.

    On equal ground, the 7 is better in some ways, but for the above reasons, the RZ is a useful rig too. I have both and use them for different purposes and like the results from both a whole lot.


    -Ed
    Last edited by EdSawyer; 11-09-2010 at 03:59 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  3. #33

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    I would go for the 50C on the RB 67.

    Jeff

  4. #34
    2F/2F's Avatar
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    The RZ is a better camera when you need to work a little bit faster while shooting, or if you want to use the 110mm f/2.8 lens. I have an RZ, but I would advise you to stick with the RB, since what you are shooting does not sound like it would benefit from use of an RZ. I prefer the RZ for shooting people, for shooting hand held, and for shooting things that are moving, but or anything else, the RB would do just as well. The very first thing I would get would be the 75mm shift lens, followed by a prism, and then more backs.

    Based on diagonal AOVs, the 110mm lens on 6x7 is closest to a 50mm lens on small format (about 15 percent longer than normal), and the 90mm is closest to a "true" normal lens (which would be about 43mm on small format).
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  5. #35
    kodachrome64's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2F/2F View Post
    The RZ is a better camera when you need to work a little bit faster while shooting, or if you want to use the 110mm f/2.8 lens. I have an RZ, but I would advise you to stick with the RB, since what you are shooting does not sound like it would benefit from use of an RZ. I prefer the RZ for shooting people, for shooting hand held, and for shooting things that are moving, but or anything else, the RB would do just as well. The very first thing I would get would be the 75mm shift lens, followed by a prism, and then more backs.

    Based on diagonal AOVs, the 110mm lens on 6x7 is closest to a 50mm lens on small format (about 15 percent longer than normal), and the 90mm is closest to a "true" normal lens (which would be about 43mm on small format).
    Maybe I didn't mention it, but I mostly shoot people (portraits and some street). Landscape/architecture is not a very high percentage of what I do.

    Obviously for landscape work the faster operation of the RZ and the fast 110mm lens wouldn't be much help. Those things appeal to me more for the shooting I usually do.
    Kodachrome
    They give us those nice bright colors
    They give us the greens of summers
    Makes you think all the world's a sunny day, oh yeah.
    -Paul Simon

  6. #36
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    I think if you're really inclined to buy an RZ, then do it. However, when i (recently!) began moving into this format i took the time and bought component by component and have an excellent condition RB set up for $300. I'd suggest the same approach. If time is not on your side, i'd still encourage buying as high quality as you can't afford. You only cry once and then enjoy your purchase for years confident it was the best available.

    I don't think you're going to hear a case whereby the RB is thrown aside enmasse for the RZ. The poll certainly does not show that, but polls are the opinions of others and not you the buyer. Whether or not they are excellent, well-founded opinions or utter idiocy - it really makes no difference b/c you're the buyer and at the end of the day you're the dude who either loves your camera or not. Buy what you *really* want - these aren't Bentley's.

    It seems to me like you're prefering a nicer RZ with the lens flexibility it provides for. Seems a no-brainer.

  7. #37
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    Sell or trade the RB in for the RZ kit.
    Everytime I find a film or paper that I like, they discontinue it. - Paul Strand - Aperture monograph on Strand

  8. #38
    CGW
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    Quote Originally Posted by kodachrome64 View Post
    Maybe I didn't mention it, but I mostly shoot people (portraits and some street). Landscape/architecture is not a very high percentage of what I do.

    Obviously for landscape work the faster operation of the RZ and the fast 110mm lens wouldn't be much help. Those things appeal to me more for the shooting I usually do.
    That "fast" 110/2.8 lens really isn't that much faster than a 3.5, especially since these lenses aren't shot wide open that often, thanks to their thin DOF. Maybe a slightly brighter viewfinder but "speed" really doesn't count for much more.

  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by CGW View Post
    That "fast" 110/2.8 lens really isn't that much faster than a 3.5, especially since these lenses aren't shot wide open that often, thanks to their thin DOF. Maybe a slightly brighter viewfinder but "speed" really doesn't count for much more.
    I shoot the 110 wide open probably 40-50% of the time. It's 3/4 stop over the 3.5 lenses, definitely an asset when you're shooting handheld as I often do, and I would damn near kill for a Zeiss 110/2.

  10. #40
    2F/2F's Avatar
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    Sounds like your mind is made up, though I cannot say I understand. How, when on a limited budget, will another body with a lens of similar focal length to the one you already have help you to fulfill the requirements of your commission? In the end, you will have nothing much different than what you already have, and still will not have what you need to get your job done. This one is a no brainer.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

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