Alternatives to Canon's ultra-expensive telephoto lenses

[cmo]

I know this is a difficult question, but I love telephoto lenses, the longer the better, but I can't afford the superb Canon super-telephoto lenses.

My main nature photo cameras are EOS 3 bodies.
I used Novoflex lenses in the past, including a 560mm Telyt head (not too bad).
I used a Tamron SP 8/500 mirror lens (not bad for a mirror lens, and I love the size, weight and "bokeh", but these are prone to flare)
At this time my longest lens is a 4/300 with a 1.4x Extender. The lens is very sharp, has a good IS and AF. With the converter image quality is half gone. With a 2x converter it would be pretty bad.

I am looking for alternatives beyond 400mm. Canon tells me:

- get a 4/400 and a converter -> $6,045.00 plus the converter
- get a 2.8/400 and a converter -> $11,499 plus the converter
- get a 4/500 -> $10,499
- wait for the new 4/200-400 with built-in converter -> probably $9,000
- get a 100-400 plus a converter -> $1,439 plus the converter, and it's not even really sharp and contrasty without using a converter
- get a used 5.6/400 plus a converter -> $1,500, no IS, no AF at f8
- get a 2.8/70-200 II plus a 1.4x and a 2x converter -> f8/560mm, $3,000, and say goodbye to sharpness

These guys raised their prices enormously during the last years. Canon goes Leica, Canon goes nuts, and Nikon is no better.

Sigma tells me:

- get a 120-300mm and a 2x converter -> $3,199 plus the converter, and say goodbye to sharpness
- get a 300mm f/2.8 EX DG HSM plus a converter -> $3,399 plus the converter
- get a 120-400mm F4,5-5,6 DG OS HSM plus a converter -> $1,000 plus the converter, and say goodbye to sharpness and contrast and forget about AF at f8

What I say about Sigma is that I had three lenses and all of them needed a repair

Some old-school guys tell me:

- get a $100 lens on ebay and get great results and bring canvas, brushes and oil ink to get a result
- get a soviet Photosniper lens for $100 and bring watercolours
- get an east german Pentacon 5.6/500mm, buy a golf caddy to carry 3.5 kilos and say goodbye to sharpness on 35mm film (these railguns are not bad for medium format)
- get a 50mm lens and walk closer to the subject

What are your recommendations for a poor guy with a limited budget? I know there will be compromises... I could live without AF and IS, but sharpness, contrast and reliabilty are important to me. I could even live with a fixed aperture (mirror lens) or using a golf caddy or pickup truck

Things that came to my mind:

- old ED Nikkors
- Reflex Nikkors
- long telephoto lenses for medium format systems
- long telephoto lenses from Pentax, Minolta, Leitz
- modifying Canon FD era lenses

PS: I own a very good tripod.

[PDH]

I would buy a T90 and FD lens, still not cheap but less that current AF lens.

[David A. Goldfarb]

Canon FD teles. I have the 600/4.5 and no complaints. I also have an original Canon FD/EOS converter--rare but they're out there--so I can use it with my New F-1 or with my EOS bodies.

Realistically, I don't see myself using AF much with a lens like that anyway (I use it mostly for birds, not usually for flight shots), and the rack-and-pinion focus is really fast and precise, particularly with the SK focusing screen on the New F-1, and lacking the whole AF apparatus, the lens is a few pounds lighter than the comparable EOS lens, which is something really worth considering, if you're schlepping it in the field.

[Jeff L]

Not AF, but there was the Tamron SP 400 f4 plus 1.4 converter. Good lens. They turn up on eBay.

[Phalbert]

I agree in full with Jeff. I had the Tamron 4/400 and it was tack sharp, until it was stolen with lots of other good stuff. In an old issue of a photo mag (I don't remember which one) Some 8/500 were compared. Results were 1. Canon FD; 2. Tamron (2nd version) 3. Nikkor. The Leitz was not part of the contest.

[gmikol]

Canon FD teles. I have the 600/4.5 and no complaints. I also have an original Canon FD/EOS converter--rare but they're out there--so I can use it with my New F-1 or with my EOS bodies.

There's also a guy out there (Ed Mika) who's machining new glassless FD-EOS converters for the long telephoto lenses that allows them to maintain infinity focus (no extra optics required) with only a minor (and fully-reversible) modification to the focusing gear. It's mostly aimed at the Canon digital crowd, but there's no reason why they shouldn't work on an EF film body (but I haven't tried it yet).

He had this table in his eBay listing:

A sample of focusing distances using the EdMika 0.5mm FD-EOS (nFD, FD, FL)-(EF,EF-S) dual-orientation glassless brass adapter

FD 85mm 1.2, 5 feet / 1.5 meters
FD 85-300mm 4.5, infinity between 250-300mm when focus stop screw removed
FD 200mm 2.8, 25 feet / 7.5 meters
FD 200mm 1.8, unknown ( infinity with lens calibration)
FD 300mm 2.8L, 95 feet / 29 meters ( infinity with lens calibration)
FD 300mm 4L, unknown (infinity with lens calibration but there is an extra pretty hard step to do it)
FD 400mm 2.8L, 164 feet / 50 meters (infinity with lens calibration)
FD 400mm 4.5, 277 feet / 85 meters (near infinity with lens calibration but I do not have details on how)
FD 500mm 4.5L, unknown (infinity with lens calibration)
FD 500mm 8 mirror, infinity (with easy removal of a stop screw under rubber focus grip)
FD 600mm 4.5, infinity (Removal of stop screw in nFD version gear housing helps maintain infinity in low temp shooting – reportedly not needed in SSC versions)
FD 800mm 5.6L, infinity (Removal of stop screw in nFD version gear housing helps maintain infinity in low temp shooting – reportedly not needed in SSC versions)

I own one of his adapters, but I haven't really used it much, other than to check for basic functionality, at this point.

Just another option to consider.

Also, considering how often you plan on using a long telephoto (and where you are located), you could always rent one for the times you need it.

--Greg

[TheFlyingCamera]

Another thought would be getting a Contax 300 F4 and the Contax 2x Tele-Mutar if you don't mind manual focus. For another 70 Euro you can get a user-installable mount adapter from Leitax that will maintain infinity focus and even provide data connection between the lens and body. You'll still be shooting in stop-down mode with Aperture Priority, but it's one set of superior glass that won't break your bank, and the teleconverter won't seriously degrade your image quality.

[cmo]

I agree in full with Jeff. I had the Tamron 4/400 and it was tack sharp, until it was stolen with lots of other good stuff. In an old issue of a photo mag (I don't remember which one) Some 8/500 were compared. Results were 1. Canon FD; 2. Tamron (2nd version) 3. Nikkor. The Leitz was not part of the contest.

Interesting... do you remember how the praised Minolta 8/500 was judged? I know for sure the Leitz is identical.

[cmo]

There's also a guy out there (Ed Mika) who's machining new glassless FD-EOS converters for the long telephoto lenses that allows them to maintain infinity focus (no extra optics required) with only a minor (and fully-reversible) modification to the focusing gear.

Greg, that is great news :-) Now I know what to do with my FD 2.8/200 and will also look out for the big artillery.

Jeff and Phalbert, the Tamron seems to be pretty rare... or people just don't sell it.

[skahde]

Clemens, it needs a bit of patience, but they are out there. Whenever I look I find an offer every third or second time.