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  1. #21

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    On the film. Should have mentioned that.
    I do have a grid screen - I just wonder if my screen is not properly in place?

    Idk, I'm telling you, I am meticulous and know what my compositions are, so either I'm losing it, or something is wrong!

    Mark
    Quote Originally Posted by Les Sarile View Post
    They are crooked on the film or on the print?
    If on the film perhaps you need to use a focusing screen with crosslines for reference - if your camera has that option.

  2. #22

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    This is fascinating. Well, it's good to know I'm not the only one with this complication!

    Mark


    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Nadvornick View Post
    I had this problem for years. Didn't really pay attention until someone commented about slightly crooked horizons. I went back and looked closely at past photos and realized it was true.

    Looked in a mirror and realized my eye sockets themselves are not perfectly horizontally aligned. One is slightly higher than the other. Don't know if that's the cause. Maybe I'm like Dr. Frankenstein's Monster. Could also be an inner ear defect, I suppose. But my eyesight is fine.

    So I fitted my Nikons with the same gridded 'E' type screen mentioned above. It's used for architectural work. That did the trick. But now when the grid says it's correct, it still feels wrong to me. And when it feels right, the grid says it's wrong.



    Ken

  3. #23

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    Really interesting discussion. It's just so interesting to me that others have this issue. So if I'm understanding properly, I just put a level on top of the camera? I'm not completely comprehending how leveling my camera necessarily levels my image?

    Mark

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by mporter012 View Post
    I do have a grid screen - I just wonder if my screen is not properly in place?
    Since you also mention focus problems, the screen could be out of alignment or just not seated properly. Try a different camera, and a different screen in your FE2, in side-by-side comparisons.

    I actually don't use an E screen in my F3, I prefer a P screen. This has cross-hairs dividing the screen up into quadrants, as well as micro-prism collar and diagonal split-image focusing aids.

    I had this problem for years. Didn't really pay attention until someone commented about slightly crooked horizons. I went back and looked closely at past photos and realized it was true.

    Looked in a mirror and realized my eye sockets themselves are not perfectly horizontally aligned. One is slightly higher than the other. Don't know if that's the cause. Maybe I'm like Dr. Frankenstein's Monster. Could also be an inner ear defect, I suppose. But my eyesight is fine.
    I discovered my issue with crooked horizons while shooting for my college newspaper. My eye problems are the result of a seizure I had when very young, which left me with third cranial nerve palsy. This basically paralyzed the right side of my face to some extent, especially my right eye, which also moved out of alignment with my left eye. I've had several eye muscle surgeries to put it back into something approaching the right position, but it barely moves and doesn't dilate (it's closed down to a smaller aperture). The doctors also suggested that my left eye be patched for several hours a day over a few years when I was young, to encourage me to use my right eye. As a result of this, my left eye is very nearsighted and I do not see in three dimensions unless I really concentrate on focusing both eyes on the same point. All of this got me very interested in eyesight and eventually photography.
    Last edited by rthomas; 08-03-2013 at 12:32 PM. Click to view previous post history. Reason: typo

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by mporter012 View Post
    Really interesting discussion. It's just so interesting to me that others have this issue. So if I'm understanding properly, I just put a level on top of the camera? I'm not completely comprehending how leveling my camera necessarily levels my image?

    Mark
    The horizon is only level at sea. On land it can vary. A level is only useful if it is adjusted so the bubble is centered when the camera is level. Gridlines are your only really useful tool here, as anyone who uses a view camera for architecture can attest.

  6. #26

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    Yes, this is kinda what I thought. Maybe others can speak to why a level necessarily corrects the issue?

    Mark


    Quote Originally Posted by E. von Hoegh View Post
    The horizon is only level at sea. On land it can vary. A level is only useful if it is adjusted so the bubble is centered when the camera is level. Gridlines are your only really useful tool here, as anyone who uses a view camera for architecture can attest.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mporter012 View Post
    Yes, this is kinda what I thought. Maybe others can speak to why a level necessarily corrects the issue?

    Mark
    If you are doing architectural photography, most buildings are built vertical to the ground, so if you use a spirit level to level the camera, the verticals of the building should be vertical (as long as you don't point the camera up, in which case you may need rising front to correct this.

    “The contemplation of things as they are, without error or confusion, without substitution or imposture, is in itself a nobler thing than a whole harvest of invention”

    Francis Bacon

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by mporter012 View Post
    I'm not completely comprehending how leveling my camera necessarily levels my image?

    Mark
    Forget the lens for a moment, because with well designed, well corrected, normal rectilinear lenses, the lens is essentially irrelevant to parallax.

    The orientation of the film to the subject controls the parallax relationships.

    If the film is paralel to the actual important verticals and horizontals in your scene then those verticals and horizontals will be straight on the film too.

    A hot shoe or spot level is a pretty darn good way to get roll and pitch very close, yaw requires visual correction regardless.

    The problem with a level is that in the real world there is precious little, if anything, that is truly and perfectly vertical or horizontal when compared to anything else; thats just a fact of life on a "round" world.
    Mark Barendt, Ignacio, CO

    "We do not see things the way they are. We see things the way we are." Anaïs Nin

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by lxdude View Post
    The OP has mentioned elsewhere having a Nikon FE2
    Whoops, I was thinking the FED2 not FE2 haha doh!!


    Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  10. #30

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    [/QUOTE]The problem with a level is that in the real world there is precious little, if anything, that is truly and perfectly vertical or horizontal when compared to anything else; thats just a fact of life on a "round" world.[/QUOTE]

    It is still up for debate whether the world if round or flat

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