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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by David A. Goldfarb View Post
    . For color slide films, a less contrasty lens can give you a bit more shadow detail in harder light.
    That is why you suggested Canon lenses for color film and Nikon ones for B/W, then.
    J

  2. #12
    darinwc's Avatar
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    Dear Pluto,
    I would recommend you change the direction of your post. Declarations of patronage to a particular manufacturers equipment line do not benefit anyone. Generalizations about image quality only serve to continue a fallacy that equipment is more important than technique.

    I would like to see some examples of images you are comparing. Please include full details about cameras, lenses, film, and printing. Only then can we discuss the characteristics of a particular combination. I say characteristics rather than merits, because each combination becomes a tool that is equally useful in the right hands.

  3. #13

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    Sorry, but what you write is not the sense of my post which is, least of all, a "declaration of patronage".
    Dear darinwc, with no intension to flow dispute, please, read better my posts
    I apologize for any misunderstandig anyway.
    J.

  4. #14

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    Apples should only be compared to apples !

    Quote Originally Posted by pluto View Post
    Thanks, Rol Lei Nut.
    Comparison of course has been made with Canon FD 50/1,4 and Nikon AFD 50/1,4, Canon FD 20/2,8 and Nikon AFD 20/2,8 and so on.
    Differences are, for ex., less visible with 20mm but film appears better with Nikon lenses yet. Higher definition, sharper negative....
    My Canon lenses are of about 20 years ago. Peraphs this means something, I think.
    I note you do not use Canon F1!
    J.
    I had both Canon F1n's & Canon F1N's, in the vernacular. I'll let someone
    else explain, as it is universally agreed upon that Canon is the worst model
    naming company, in photography, although sometimes Nikon...

    Anyway, if you REALLY want to compare cameras & lenses, get a Nikon F mount lens to Canon FD camera converter. Look at eBay.

    Set-up a tripod, load both cameras with the same slide film. Kodak 100 is good for this, as it's speed is true & colors honest. Mount the Nikon 1st. Focus on an evenly lit wall, in the middle of the day. Try to keep the same meter setting. Test all of you Nikon lenses. Shoot each lens at all f-stops possible. Take careful notes; shot vs. f-stop & shutter speed.
    2. Then repeat the same procedure with the Canon F1, adapter plus all of your Nikon lenses.
    3. Finally, try the same thing with your Canon F1 & your Canon lenses.

    By taking careful notes when you get the film back, you can run a frame by
    frame analysis.

    Please post here, once done.
    I for one would be very curious at your unbiased results.

  5. #15
    Moose38's Avatar
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    Yeah people tend to get in a tizzy when you say your camera is better then there's. It in some ways sounds if your choice was better then there's. It may be better to say. I PERFER CANON over Nikon. I'm a canon guy. Canon can do no wrong by me. But that's a statment of choice. I will say you will get better image quality in your camera if you stick with Canon lenses. Which is true when it comes to the old FD stuff.

  6. #16
    benjiboy's Avatar
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    Is the O.P a good enough photographer for any differences to the final photographs to be significant ? people agonize too much about their equipment, and not enough about their photographs .
    Last edited by benjiboy; 09-07-2010 at 04:22 AM. Click to view previous post history.
    Ben

  7. #17

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    I have both a Canon F1n and a Nikon F3HP with a variety of lenses. I was a dedicated canon user since the early 1970's, now I have very many SLR's with accompåanying lenses.

    I have noted absolutely nothing of that sort.

    Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Olympus, Praktica, Praktina, Konica, Olympus Pen - ALL still give marvellous definition and contrast, given that I do my part, and given that the lenses are kept CLEAN.

    That what you write is balderwash in my book, and a thin disguise to continue the everlasting "debate" over which is better, Canon or Nikon.
    Ever considered a Leica? I have one of those too FYI.........

    Going back a lot of years, my loft used to be filled with years and years of photomagazines, english, american, german, swedish, danish, norwegian, even australian from a lengthy visityh in my young days.
    All where filled nearly to the brim with tests. Some tests where faulty, some tests was obviously bought. But the best was Modern Photography (USA) and a couple of german magazines, I think Color Photo was one of them.......

    General consensus at the time when Canon launched their Flex-1 project and that bombshell lens launch (biggest simultaneous lens launch ever?) was that Canon had the upper hand, and several years of adavantage, which was later demonstraded in lens tests during most of the 1970's, Pentax Takumars was super, Olympus OM was super, Minolta was super, Nikon had a lot of catching-up to do. And more often Canon came out on top by a slight margin.

    Nikon might finally have caught up during the late 1980's, it was a time of advances in many fields, super coating and wide-spread use of desk-top computers being the driving force, I personally think that those did most difference when it came to zoom lenses, and think that the wide-angle to short tele zooms we now enjoy would have been impossible witout.

    But Nikon being significantly better than Canon lenses, if you compare apples to apples? (lenses in the same price bracket).

    NO WAY.

    If you don't get sharp pictures from a SLR, most any SLR, made after 1970, either the lens is faulty and in need of repair, or the camera body is.

    If your'e still not satisfied, go out and make some pictures, instead if photograping printed board with geometric figures on them.

  8. #18

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    Sorry I didn't note this "discussion" had already attracted a lot of answers.

    These debates which are returng with the same certainity as US east coast hurricanes are meaningless, fruitless and pointless.

    So I promise to stay out of this one from hereon!

    Erik

    "Every time I try to get OUT, they suck me right back IN" !

  9. #19
    2F/2F's Avatar
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    The body should not make a difference unless you are using the cameras at the edges of hand holdability ('30, '60, for example), and there are vibration differences upon releasing the shutters, or if the focusing screen in the Canon is not located in its proper position (which can fairly easily happen on cameras with user-exchangeable focusing screens).

    I use '70s Canon F-1s, FT-Bs, and AE-1Ps, Nikon Fs, and occasionally a Pentax Spotmatic, and I have noticed very slight "character" differences between the 50mm lenses (due to coating differences, I assume, Nikon F lenses being single coated and most Canon FD lenses being multi-coated, as one one example), but sharpness is great with all of them. In fact, all three of my 50mm lenses for their respective systems are, what I would call "bitingly sharp," or "as sharp as I could ever hope for in my applications."

    I'd take a step back and do a controlled test at shutter speeds that are "more foolproof" (not that you are a "fool," mind you ) when hand holding, such as '500 or '1000. (I say this assuming you shoot hand held, so you can test in the manner of your normal shooting.)

    IMHO, there are a zillion things that you could be doing differently between the rolls shot through different cameras, but after checking the focusing screen, the camera body would be low on the list.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  10. #20
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    Can I add my 2 cents worth...as a former factory Canon repair technician who used to repair NF1's and EOS 1's when they were new...

    There were 3 of us in service who all took photos, and we had the opportunity to play with lots of gear...and not just Canon, as we had friends with other systems. Also this was the time when one of the major local newspapers changed over from Canon to Nikon (because they were the only paper in the group - worldwide who was using Canon..how things have changed..)..

    Our opinion, and that of most of the press guys we spoke to, was that both systems had good lenses, but generally some were better than others...

    Nikon had the better lenses in wide angle - up to 35mm.

    From 35mm to 85mm both systems were pretty even.

    From 100mm up Canon was better...

    Now I know I'm generalizing..but this is basically what we came up with...

    Sure - some Nikon tele lenses were good - 300/2.8, 200/2, 180/2.8, as were some Canon wides - 24/1.4, 24/2.8, but overall people seemed to agree.

    Please consider for a moment these comments were from working photographers who had used both systems, and were based on actual "real world" results - that is, enlargements of actual jobs...None had put cameras on tripods and tested lenses to see if one has 2 more LPM (Lines Per Millimeter) than another lens. These were just observations of the results from shooting with the various gear over several months..

    First - lets eliminate the lenses you are using....you have a FD 50/1.4. If this is the lens with the chrome mounting ring, then you have the sharpest standard lens Canon ever made..If it's the NFD 50/1.4 with the black rear, then it's still a very good lens. I'm basing this opinion on personal testing - at one stage I tested every 50mm lens I could lay my hands on - around 9 of them.

    My testing was simple - I took each lens, mounted it on the same camera body, then took a shot of a piece of paper with the lens description written on it, and then took 2 shots with the lens focussed on infinity (checking each time the lens was actually at infinity in the viewfinder, not just by putting it on infinity), and shot the same subject - mountains about 10KM away at 2 apertures. I then printed the roll on a colour printer (a old Fuji 23 series), and compared all the photos side by side.

    If you looked at 2 photos next to each other there wasn't much of a difference, but if you compared the best and worst results then the difference was quite noticable..and before you asked I used a variety of lenses - both old and new FD, including a 50 1.2L, a macro, and various f1.4 and 1.8 lenses. I even tested a NFD 50/2 - a not very common lens.....

    So what could be wrong with your NF1?

    It could be the pressure plate is a bit soft..easy enough to fix - grab each end of the pressure plate, and bend the springs up a bit so that the pressure plate has a bit more spring...don't need to bend it much, but it will eliminate any concerns there..

    It could be the mirror out of adjustment. This is easy enough to check if you have a second body. Pick any lens that stops focussing at infinity (so you can't use a canon zoom or a Tele lens with internal focus) and focus the lens on another body on infinity. Focus on a cloud or a distant tree - the subject should be straight. Now do the same with your NF1 - if it's not focussing to the same point as the other camera then the mirror is probably out of adjustment (not very common, but it does happen).

    It could also be the flange depth (the distance between the front of the lens mount and the pressure plate). The correct distance is 42.143mm. From memory the factory tolerance was about +/- 0.01mm, but I tended to adjust them to within +/- 0.002mm...

    Then again - I can remember photographers coming in with T90's where the mirror box was loose - I mean you could feel the camera kick when you fired the shutter, and they had never noticed any out of focus issues with their cameras...they'd come in for some other fault!

    Easiest way to check if your NF1 is ok is to use 2 cameras - use the same lens - at the same aperture and shutter speed - preferably using the same film loading the camera in both bodies 1 after the other.

    Do the same shots under the same lighting conditions (pick a overcast day and shoot around noon so the light doesn't change) with both bodies and compare the results. If the other body is sharper than your NF1 then you need the NF1 serviced. If the NF1 is sharper then you know all is well with the body.

    If both results look the same and neither are 100% sharp get another lens...

    Sorry to be so long winded..but you did ask what it could be?

    Cheers

    Andrew
    A camera is only a black box with a hole in it....

    my blog...some film, some digital http://andrewk1965.wordpress.com/

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