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  1. #1
    rhmimac's Avatar
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    2nd hand Pro camera's more suspectable for failure?

    My newest 2nd hand camera let me down after 3 months. Nikon F4S.
    Shutterproblems: half frame underexposure or full underexposure.

    Could it be that buying progear leads to more chance on encountering worn out mechanics, suspectible electronics?
    My thoughts were: let's buy a pro camera, it got more gimmicks(MLU,..), it's more durable so would be less risk.
    Now I'm back on the other side: buy a medium specced thingy, less gimmicks but also mostly less used and still in better shape.

    True?

    rhmimac

  2. #2
    Sirius Glass's Avatar
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    Not necessarily. It comes down to a few things:

    • Quality of the design and manufacturing of the original equipment
    • The amount of use of the piece of equipment you are considering
    • The lifetime maintenance of said piece of equipment

    A less than stellar camera will usually have poor reliability.
    A well used professional camera that has been maintained properly will continue, generally, to perform well if the maintenance is kept up.
    A well designed camera that is a closet queen will need a CLA to start with. How it runs after that, there are no sure bets.

    Steve
    Warning!! Handling a Hasselblad can be harmful to your financial well being!

    Nothing beats a great piece of glass!

    I leave the digital work for the urologists and proctologists.

  3. #3

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    If you buy second hand gear that has been used by a pro then it will have been used very hard indeed,much harder than the normal amateur would use it,and would be sold when it starts to give the pro problems, so if you buy ex pro gear be prepared to have it serviced, the same goes for m.f.pro gear,Take it from one who knows, I would hang on to my gear as long as it worked, if it was looking like needing major work it would be part exchanged for new gear, I am a pro myself, Richard

  4. #4

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    I agree with Steve, a working pro that truly relies on his equipment, as opposed to a well heeled amateur, will typically maintain his/her equipment regularly, and will make a point of telling you if you ask them.

    I've owned several F4s through the years, everyone I bought that was from an amateur needed a CLA, without exception. The two that I bought from working pros (and they really showed it, looking "well used") performed flawlessly out of the box, and even with my reduced film usage, continue to.

  5. #5
    2F/2F's Avatar
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    It depends, and unless you really know the history of the camera, you really just cannot tell.

    I certainly know I would never buy one of my boss' 5Ds, the way she sprays and prays in her shoots. I have a 10D (now a seven-year-old camera) that has under 20K shots on it, and is cosmetically trashed. This camera did see regular, though not heavy, professional use (probably 5 events a week on average, when I was actually working steadily) for the first five years of its life, when I shot for a newspaper and lots of bands. I would call it "semi-pro" use. Even then, it only has that many shots on it. I only use it occasionally now. The shutter is still perfectly accurate and everything works as it did when new. I have had it serviced once, at five years of age, to CLA it, and fix a loose shutter button, and have had the sensor cleaned at least 20 times. I used to have this done free, by Canon. She, on the other hand, will shoot at least 2,000 shots on every full-day job, so her shutters have to have been fired well over their specified shutter life by now, and I know she never has the cameras serviced, and never will unless they break. On the other hand, her cameras look cosmetically pristine, and seem to work just fine. Go figure!

    If I was a third party, and knew what I knew about both my and my boss' cameras, I would buy them from neither of us...but if I did not know about them, I would probably buy hers because they look better taken care of...and have my shutter start acting up after those hundreds of thousands of exposures.

    So, you just never know...unless you happen to know!
    Last edited by 2F/2F; 05-08-2010 at 12:55 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  6. #6
    rhmimac's Avatar
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    Very, very interesting my friends. Especially when you pro's give sound advice on these sometimes tricky 2nd hand business.
    It's every Little Man's dream to own and use the Big Man's gear. And maybe that's not needed at all. But it's the only way to get hands on the best on the planet. When a amateur like me wants a D3 or even much better a F6 we have to wait for another 3 to 5 yrs to get them into reach of our budget. It's all spending you know, no refunding when a pic is brillant!
    My F4S went back to my store. I got a 3 months waranty on it so it will be or repaired, get a (minimum) CLA, or will be trashed and I'll be refunded or I'll choose some other 2nd hand camera for the same amount of cash.
    It's my 4th or 5th camera from them. Warranty wasn't and isn't a problem for them. Therefor they always get my cash when I see anything what's in my reach- the F4S was, even without much thinking from my side.

    rhmimac

  7. #7
    Rol_Lei Nut's Avatar
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    Ehhhmmm... Why exactly do you want a "pro" camera? What are you looking for and what are your needs?

    My "Pro" cameras now tend to be Leica Rs (as well as Pentax 6x7s), but they were tendentially used by portrait, nature and landscape photographers rather than, say, PJs, meaning typically much less wear & tear (and also much more suitied for my needs & interests).

    I also use some definitely "non-Pro" cameras, but they do their particular job very well.

    A "pro" camera is really what meets your needs, whatever they are....
    M6, SL, SL2, R5, P6x7, SL3003, SL35-E, F, F2, FM, FE-2, Varex IIa

  8. #8
    rhmimac's Avatar
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    Pro gear

    Quote Originally Posted by Rol_Lei Nut View Post
    Ehhhmmm... Why exactly do you want a "pro" camera? What are you looking for and what are your needs?
    It's not the "pro" title that attracks me to the Big Man's gear but it's the possibilities this stuf gives to create things further than you once expected you could. Take MLU, DOF, all controls on dedicated knobs&wheels(did you ever digged in the modern gear's menu's-it makes you crazy or lazy), double exposure, choose manual rewind or motor rewind, vertical grip with 2nd shutter button, closeable viewer, Everready NiHh batts instead of Lithiums to name a few F4s things my F65 doesn't give me.
    I think the word " control" sticks out of it. When I look through the viewfinder I place my fingers on the knobs and I can stay connected to the subject.

    It all comes with a price.

    I wanted a Hassy for starting the 120 experience. Not now anymore.

    Little man stays little for a while.

    Any thoughts on this?

    Thanks

    rhmimac

  9. #9
    Rol_Lei Nut's Avatar
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    Well, a 1965 Pentax Spotmatic can give most of those things (apart from MLU, vertical grip and motorised rewind - batteries & closable viewfinder not being an issue) for typically about € 40 ...


    If you like "control" and "being connected with the subject", most "classical" cameras can offer the same or better.
    Take a look at some older or "non-professional" cameras (maybe check out the ones in my signature, though ask before buying the Rolleiflexes). ;-)

    Ask yourself if you really need AF, programme mode, motor advance & all the other gadgets now considered normal.
    M6, SL, SL2, R5, P6x7, SL3003, SL35-E, F, F2, FM, FE-2, Varex IIa

  10. #10
    rhmimac's Avatar
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    Pro gear

    Quote Originally Posted by Rol_Lei Nut View Post
    Well, a 1965 Pentax Spotmatic can give most of those things (apart from MLU, vertical grip and motorised rewind - batteries & closable viewfinder not being an issue) for typically about € 40 ...
    I tried to find a manual "classic" for some time but the nikon go way up to snobbist prices in belgium. A FE or FA for the price of a pro AF SLR, you know...
    As I wasn't raised in the MF era and started photographing in 1993, AF is my way of working for 17 yrs now.


    [/QUOTE]If you like "control" and "being connected with the subject", most "classical" cameras can offer the same or better.
    Take a look at some older or "non-professional" cameras (maybe check out the ones in my signature, though ask before buying the Rolleiflexes). ;-)

    Ask yourself if you really need AF, programme mode, motor advance & all the other gadgets now considered normal.[/QUOTE]

    No, I don't need it at all. I fully agree. It's not about the camera, it's about the man/woman behind it and about the light.

    Maybe the quote on the man's page underneath says it all:


    http://www.thiaps.com/featured_artis...non-trent.html

    Thanks for replying!
    rhmimac

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