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Thread: 35mm SLR - why?

  1. #121
    SilverGlow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2F/2F View Post
    We obviously have different criteria for judging our images, and different ideas of what looks good.

    It is as simple as this: I have my criteria for what I want from an "imaging system. Right now, digital is nowhere close to meeting my criteria," while film meets them (because it has, in fact defined them). When digital meets them, and does it affordably and enjoyably, I will switch.

    ...and any gallery owner or publisher I want to deal with will feel exactly the same way, or I won't deal with them. I am not going to be a slave to what gallery owners or publishers want. It should go the other way, in fact. They pick you because they want to sell your pictures; because they fit in to their gallery, and they believe they can make money. You don't change your work to be what they want. They represent/publish you because they think your work as it is can make them money. At the very least, most will understand and respect my views, even if they do not hold them.

    I am not interested in having anything better than the results I get from film, in the photo rag definition of better. I am interested in having these film results, exactly. In fact, these results are what causes me to shoot film. Most people in this day and age just do not get this point of view. They feel that the technology available should constantly redefine what one wants. Certainly, technology available can have a huge impact on what one wants, as it did with me, learning on film. I'd probably want different things if I was born and bred on digital. However, I cannot so easily redefine my aesthetic preferences when new technology comes along, nor should I be expected or forced to. So, I like what I get from film. It is perfect for me and for my work. SO, when digital can give me exactly what I get from film, and the equipment is as affordable as is film equipment, and the equipment will last me 20 to 30 years after I buy it (I refuse to treat cameras - or anything, for that matter - as disposable consumer electronics as apposed to high-quality, long-lasting, serviceable tools.), and all of my old cameras are broken and all the people who know how to repair them are dead, and film stops being made, then digital will be my primary way of taking pix. Till then, I will not be holding my breath. I will just shoot what I have until I feel that there is something that exceeds it in all respects.

    In the commercial world, what clients want is almost totally defined by the technology that is available, as opposed to actual aesthetics. Therefore, it is no surprise that film is all but gone from the commercial world. The sad thing is that artists don't spend enough money alone to support the market, so a whole bunch of great materials went out the door when commercial work went digital. The only way to keep film alive, IMHO, is for it to have a BIG resurgence in commercial work. Artists have always largely been forced to use the materials that the commercial world makes available, and it is no different with photography.
    You have somehow lost your way, friend. You think it's about the medium.

    It's about the picture!

    It's the composition, and if the comp is heart moving, who cares what the medium is?

    It's the Picture.

    Pick Ture!
    Coming back home to my film roots. Canon EOS-3 SLR, Canon EOS 1V SLR, 580ex flash, and 5D DSLR shooter. Prime lens only shooter.

  2. #122
    BradS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilverGlow View Post
    You have somehow lost your way, friend. You think it's about the medium.

    It's about the picture!

    It's the composition, and if the comp is heart moving, who cares what the medium is?

    It's the Picture.

    Pick Ture!

    Did you even read what he wrote?

  3. #123

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    I have the finest full-frame image sensor available in the world on my $50 camera. I get a fresh sensor with every shot and if I'm not happy with my sensor, I can change to any other sensor from multiple manufacturers in 30 seconds.

    Can't do that with digital.

  4. #124
    lxdude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilverGlow View Post
    Your argumments are a tempest in a teapot....you are a rebel without a cause ;-)

    You write what you write, yet there are thousands of old timer film shooters that have successfully added digital photography to their toolbox and are making awesome images that way.

    Go ahead, fight your windmills Don Quixote.... :-)
    I don't really see much of a tempest. The point was that film gives a physical object which can be examined without having to be decoded by a machine. There is an image which exists in physical form. I think that is a valid reason. It is for me. I much prefer looking at a piece of film to looking at an image on a screen.
    You have your reasons for using film. They are valid for you, and might not make sense for someone else. But they work for you.

  5. #125

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    Quote Originally Posted by SilverGlow View Post
    You think it's about the medium.
    This is, in fact, exactly the opposite of what I stated.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  6. #126

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    Lately, I've been shooting a lot with a Rolleiflex SL 35 E and various lenses. Love the viewfinder and very pleased with the images.

    It can do some things that a rangefinder can't. The opposite also is true.

  7. #127

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    Quote Originally Posted by SilverGlow View Post
    Your argumments are a tempest in a teapot....you are a rebel without a cause ;-)

    You write what you write, yet there are thousands of old timer film shooters that have successfully added digital photography to their toolbox and are making awesome images that way.

    Go ahead, fight your windmills Don Quixote.... :-)
    And your argument is but an ad hominem attack that fails to controvert a single fact I wrote. Thanks for the compliment.

    Once again:

    "I can see the images on my film negatives and transparencies, because they are there.

    But I can't see any images on or in my RAW, jpg, or tif computer files, because there are none there."

    And, "thousands of old timer film shooters" who are now digitalistas can't change that fact.


  8. #128

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    Quote Originally Posted by lxdude View Post
    I don't really see much of a tempest. The point was that film gives a physical object which can be examined without having to be decoded by a machine. There is an image which exists in physical form. I think that is a valid reason. It is for me. I much prefer looking at a piece of film to looking at an image on a screen.
    Spot on.

    Although, if I may, I would reword your last sentence as, "I much prefer looking at a piece of film to looking at a computer file comprised of 1s and 0s."

    Image on Film ≠ 1s and 0s

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by telyt View Post
    The funny thing is that at the molecular level film is digital and a CCD or CMOS sensor is analog. The film image is invisible until the developer converts the higher electron valence levels to silver halide grains. The valence levels are discrete steps, i.e., a digital representation of electron energy. The latent film image is analogous to the digital raw file, it must be developed before anyone can see it.

    A CMOS or CCD sensor records the image with electrons, and requires an analog-to-digital converter to create the image file. Either film or CCD/CMOS, the electrons must be processed before anyone can see the image.

    An excellent example of how a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.:rolleyes:

    Oh funny, indeed.

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Naples View Post
    Spot on.

    Although, if I may, I would reword your last sentence as, "I much prefer looking at a piece of film to looking at a computer file comprised of 1s and 0s."

    Image on Film ≠ 1s and 0s
    Well, I was referring specifically to examining the images in the forms in which they first appear. As you say, the digital images don't exist until they're on the screen.
    Last edited by lxdude; 06-16-2010 at 08:16 AM. Click to view previous post history.
    I do use a digital device in my photographic pursuits when necessary.
    When someone rags on me for using film, I use a middle digit, upraised.



 

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