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  1. #61
    Dinesh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Kadillak View Post
    ...His objective is to produce the best final product possible and through years of experience be a master of all of the materials/process along the way
    Why do I get the feeling that you would have capitalized the "H" no matter where it was placed in the sentence!
    Kick his ass, Sea Bass!

  2. #62
    billschwab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Kadillak View Post
    His objective is to produce the best final product possible
    Blah, blah, blah.... BLAH...

    Get a grip, man. In your haste to defend and perpetuate the myth, you seem to have missed the fact I said nothing about the precious paper. What I have said before and I am not afraid to say again is that I have yet to see anything produced by the "Master" that would give them the right to treat ANYONE the way I've seen people I actually have some respect for treated here and else ware. Talk about "ignorant comments"! In my opinion the product suffers greatly in the hands of the messenger and that is a shame. As for the implication that a print cannot be a masterwork without benefit of the "best" paper? This is nothing more than a complete load of immature, snake oil salesman crap.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by billschwab View Post
    In my opinion the product suffers greatly in the hands of the messenger and that is a shame.
    If you are interested in printing on a AgCl contact paper, don't let anyone's personality deter you from doing so. Lodima is a superb paper. In some ways I prefer it to Azo.

    However, after watching Bob Carnie demonstrate his split grade printing technique on Iflord Multigrade IV paper using negatives developed in Pyrocat HD (semi-stand, similar to the method I use), I've made prints on the Multigrade which I'll put up against any of my AgCl prints. Perhaps the major benefit of my involvement with the New England Large Format Photography Collective is the constant exposure to new (to me, at any rate) and varied techniques by accomplished photographers and printers. We should always keep our minds open and receptive to new and different techniques, particularly from the younger generation of art school graduates.

    Hell, I've seen prints by Paul Taylor on Ilford MG from wet plate collodion negatives which take my breath away. So, Bill is right. You can create a masterpiece with anything. Go out and do it.

    If Weston's way is how you like to do it and the paper works for you, by all means use it. But to say that any one process, much less any one product, is essential for producing one's best work...well, what do you think?
    Last edited by c6h6o3; 12-06-2009 at 01:49 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by billschwab View Post
    To the OP... have a blast!!! And while you're loving the big negatives and CP, don't forget there are a lot of other things to try... platinum, palladium, gum, Van Dykes...
    unfortunately, I can't afford to run any other alt. processes right now. my budget is REALLY thin :o

    eventually though!

    -Dan


  5. #65
    DanielStone's Avatar
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    thanks everyone for all the answers, I really appreciate the help!

    well, I still haven't been able to get things under way, but I have been showing my parents this post, and thankfully, they're warming up to the idea of me using the bathroom after hours .

    I'd love to try the Lodima paper from M&P, but I have one more question:

    how to control contrast with Lodima? I have heard that some contact printers use a custom box that houses the lightbulb, but has a "filter drawer" underneath that lets the printer change contrast filters for dodging/burning, etc...

    I try to get my negatives spot-on in development, but sometimes it needs a bit of a boost (I generally develop a little lower contrast that most would, I just like to be able to retain detail).

    help would be appreciated, and if we could please get back on topic I understand how some get flustered over a certain process or photographer's method, but can we keep these things to ourselves?

    thank you Michael(and Paula ) for producing and bringing to market this terrific product! I hope to be able to try this great paper one day sometime soon!

    blessings,

    Dan


  6. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanielStone View Post
    I'd love to try the Lodima paper from M&P, but I have one more question:

    how to control contrast with Lodima? I have heard that some contact printers use a custom box that houses the lightbulb, but has a "filter drawer" underneath that lets the printer change contrast filters for dodging/burning, etc...


    blessings,

    Dan
    Dan, Lodima is a fixed grade paper, grades 2 and 3 are now available. The contrast filters you refer to are for VC papers.

    To reduce contrast with Lodima; it responds well to Amidol and water bath treatment. Place the paper in developer as per usual then part way through development, transfer to a water bath and leave without agitation for the remainder of the development time. The recommended dev time for Lodima is 1 minute. The less time in developer and more time in the water bath, the softer the effect. You will need to experiment so as not to get uneven print development.

    I've not attempted to try and increase contrast so not sure how it reponds to increased developer concentration (something I used to do with fixed grade projection papers) and development times. Lodima does start to cool off in print colour for development times beyond 1 minute.

  7. #67

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    Dan,

    The BEST place to ask any and all questions concerning Azo, Lodima or any of the now defunct silver chloride papers is the Azo forum. You can cut through all the personality BS and get straight answers to your questions. You will find MAS more than willing to share his knowledge and expertise with anyone who asks a question. All he asks is you read his articles and do a simple forum search so he doesn't waste his time re-answering questions he has already answered. Seems like a reasonable request to me. There is even a section of the Azo forum dedicated to Lodima. By the way, the Azo forum has quite a few folks who really know their stuff and freely share their knowledge.

    I found having a well lit (ie Thomas Safe Light) darkroom helps considerably when using a water bath. You need to be able to see the shadows in order to know when to transfer the print from the developer to the water bath. You might want to consider placing a safelight close to and above the developer tray to monitor the shadows.
    John Bowen

  8. #68
    c6h6o3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgjbowen View Post
    I found having a well lit (ie Thomas Safe Light) darkroom helps considerably when using a water bath. You need to be able to see the shadows in order to know when to transfer the print from the developer to the water bath. You might want to consider placing a safelight close to and above the developer tray to monitor the shadows.
    I find it impossible to judge when to pull a print from the water bath by watching the shadows develop, no matter how bright the safelight. Once I settle on an overall development time (usually 1' 40'' for Canadian G2, 1' for anything else) I vary the proportion of water bath to total time to achieve optimal contrast. But I have to see the print with the lights on to make my determination. Different strokes for different folks.

    To Daniel Stone: you should try to find someone in your area (I'm sure there are plenty) who prints on Azo to show you how to use a water bath. It's easy but you need to do it in a certain way. Maybe Michael Smith can point you to someone in Southern CA.

  9. #69
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    thanks c6,

    I appreciate the candor on the subject.

    Anyone in SoCal who would be willing to show me how to do water bath dev?

    would the WB development technique work with traditional silver papers too? i.e. projection papers?

    thanks

    -Dan


  10. #70
    Lee L's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanielStone View Post
    would the WB development technique work with traditional silver papers too? i.e. projection papers?
    Yes.

    Having someone experienced might help a bit, but water bath development isn't a big secret, and it's likely to vary a bit with your paper and developer choices. It's covered in AA's The Print, Tim Rudman's Master Printing Course, Les McLean's book, Horenstein's Beyond Basic Photography, and I know I've seen it described by David Vestal somewhere, but didn't see it at a quick run through his Art of B&W Enlarging. Their approaches are all basically the same.

    It's basically:

    developer until blacks start to show
    1 minute water bath without agitation
    back to developer to recharge
    another minute water bath without agitation
    don't lather
    don't rinse
    repeat until you like it.

    Lee



 

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