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  1. #11
    wiltw's Avatar
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    No capacitor in the AA holder of my 45CL3 or 45CT4. The original owner manual provides no explicit warning against the use of rechargeables in the 45-39 AA holder, although the instructions do say "use only alkaline manganese batteries of size IEC LR 6 (penlight cells size AA)"

    The 45-40 Nicad pack from Metz is not one that is designed for the user to remove and replace cells. The Nicads in this holder are factory installed in the pack.
    Last edited by wiltw; 02-04-2010 at 03:44 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by wiltw View Post
    No capacitor in the AA holder of my 45CL3 or 45CT4. The original owner manual provides no explicit warning against the use of recharge45-39 ables in the AA holder, although the instructions do say "use only alkaline manganese batteries of size IEC LR 6 (penlight cells size AA)"

    The 45-40 Nicad pack from Metz is not one that is designed for the user to remove and replace cells. The Nicads in this holder are factory installed in the pack.
    Now while I still have not received an official word from Metz/Bogen, I am thinking that the ones without the "capacitor" are the older "AA" holders, while those with that "thingie" are the newer design, made for re-chargable "AA" batteries, but NOT for use with NiCads or the newer NiMH batteries. As stated by "wiltw" , the NiCads/NiMH holders are sealed so to speak and not meant to be taken apart and messed with.

    Once again, if official word from Metz/Bogen arrives, I'll post.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Q.G. View Post
    Ordinary NiCads provide a lower voltage. Not higher.
    I have used NiCads for eons in the battery holder, and never a problem (except with capacity).
    I was quoting from the manual http://www.metzflash.co.uk/pages/pdfpage.htm.
    Ben

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by benjiboy View Post
    I was quoting from the manual http://www.metzflash.co.uk/pages/pdfpage.htm.
    Not very accurately then.
    The manual only says something about not using Lithium batteries.

    Do not use lithium cells! Their higher voltage would damage the flash
    unit’s electronic system. Only use the permitted power sources (see
    above). Warranty claims for faults and damage to the flash unit are not
    accepted if they were caused by the use of accessories from other manufacturers.


    It says that in every language included in the manual.

    NiCads are 1.2 V, opposed to regular alkaline battery's 1.5 V.
    So no problem.

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Q.G. View Post
    Not very accurately then.
    The manual only says something about not using Lithium batteries.

    Do not use lithium cells! Their higher voltage would damage the flash
    unit’s electronic system. Only use the permitted power sources (see
    above). Warranty claims for faults and damage to the flash unit are not
    accepted if they were caused by the use of accessories from other manufacturers.


    It says that in every language included in the manual.

    NiCads are 1.2 V, opposed to regular alkaline battery's 1.5 V.
    So no problem.
    ...... yes but...

    The 45 CL-4 Digital manual mentions that ( do not use lithium cells), the manual for the older 45 CL-4 makes no statement about lithium.
    It's possible that the newer Digital models circuit is different than the older model hence that statement.

    The lithium "AA" batteries that I use are 1.5v same as a regular alkaline or even the old carbon battery so I am not sure what they mean by higher voltage!

    Anyway, still awaiting an official answer from the "Metz/Bogen and the Emerald City wizard behind the curtain"

    Will post if I hear anything :rolleyes:

  6. #16

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    Lack of mention of lithium battery with older flash is likely because Lithium type battery for AA size did not exist or was not in common use at the time those flash units were produced. It makes sense that manufacturer does not want users to operate flash with anything but power source which the circuit was originally designed to handle. Too low or too high inconsistency may just be a translation error Metz being a German company.

    Hold on tight. It took Metz few days to answer my question. But they did include a full and complete answer once it did answer.
    Develop, stop, fix.... wait.... where's my film?

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ira Rush View Post
    ...... yes but...

    The 45 CL-4 Digital manual mentions that ( do not use lithium cells), the manual for the older 45 CL-4 makes no statement about lithium.
    It's possible that the newer Digital models circuit is different than the older model hence that statement.
    It is. But that will probably not be the reason.
    Lithium batteries are a more recent invention than the 45 CL 4.

    (P.S. see that tkamiya made the same point.)

    But anyway, i was making a point about NiCads. Not Lithium batteries.

    The problem using NiCads and the older 45 CT Series Metz units was something about the 'ready' light and when that would light. The CL series got a different circuit including a different ready light.

    The bigger problem however was that NiCads then held half of the capacity of normal Alkalines, less than that even when the NiCads were getting old. The flash would recharge slower too.

    But only such inconveniences. Never a danger to the unit itself.

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by tkamiya View Post
    Too low or too high inconsistency may just be a translation error Metz being a German company.
    The German text says the same as the text in other languages in the manuals.

  9. #19

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    Yeah, that was a wild guess on my part. (concerning possible translation error) Being bilingual between Japanese and English, badly translated manuals are constant source of chuckles...
    Develop, stop, fix.... wait.... where's my film?

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by tkamiya View Post
    Lack of mention of lithium battery with older flash is likely because Lithium type battery for AA size did not exist or was not in common use at the time those flash units were produced......
    .... True

    Quote Originally Posted by Q.G. View Post
    ...Lithium batteries are a more recent invention than the 45 CL 4.
    (P.S. see that tkamiya made the same point.)
    .... True


    But....

    I have the original manual for my 45 CL-4, when I got it a number of years ago. In the section regarding “Power Supply” aside from not mentioning Lithium batteries (yes, yes I know, I know, way, way before its time) it does mention the P-50 power pack and the N-22 or N-23 A/C power supply (both of which has been discontinued for a very long, long time).

    The newer manual (obtained on-line as a pdf) for the 45 CL-4, “plain unit” (for lack of a better word, i.e. not the Digital or Digital Basic kit), again under the section "Power Supply", you will note it drops the mention of the long discontinued N-22 or N-23, but still mentions the P-50 power pack. Once again it does not mention anything regarding lithium.

    My point…. If they edited the manual to include dropping the mention of the A/C power supply, surely they would have included the disclaimer about lithium, if they were so worried about it.

    I still think that the circuitry for the newer 45 CL-4 Digital is much different, and more importantly I think when they say not to use lithium, they are referring to some lithium batteries that are indeed of a higher power rating per battery then others (1.75v).

    The brand of lithium batteries that I use is rated 1.5v each, same as the alkaline.

    Of course this is all a moot point until / if Metz/Bogen ever decides to provide a more concrete and official response, regarding that "capacitor thingie".

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