Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 75,746   Posts: 1,670,479   Online: 795
      
Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 43
  1. #31

    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    North America just north of that sharp right turn North America makes on the Atlantic coast.
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    602
    Here is a good way to think about M3 and #5 flash bulbs, I know because I have done it.

    With an M3 at about 1/30 sec and F/8 you can illuminate some people IN your back yard at night.

    With a #5 at about 1/30 sec and F/8 you can illuminate some people AND your back yard at night.

    I have tried this in a Honeywell Tilt-a-Mite, the M3 and #5 may have about the same light output, but the #5 can spread it out a lot better than the M3.
    "Would you like it if someone that painted in oils told you that you were not making portraits because you were using a camera?"
    "Shouldn't it be more about the joy of producing and viewing the photo than what you paid for the camera?"

    Me

  2. #32

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati Ohio USA
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    674
    Real tests ALWAYS top what the manufacturer says their product does. Test bulbs with your camera and film combo to insure it works for you.

  3. #33

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Horsham, PA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    751
    Quote Originally Posted by bblhed View Post
    I have tried this in a Honeywell Tilt-a-Mite, the M3 and #5 may have about the same light output, but the #5 can spread it out a lot better than the M3.
    The M3 and #5 don't have nearly the same light output. They have similar guide numbers, but if you look at the fine print, you'll see that the M3 is for a 3" reflector, and the #5 is for a 5" reflector. Basically, this means that with the tilt-a-mite (5" reflector), the M3s are actually a stop dimmer than their GN says, as evidenced by your test.
    "Panic not my child, the Great Yellow Father has your hand"--Larry Dressler

  4. #34

    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    North America just north of that sharp right turn North America makes on the Atlantic coast.
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    602
    Quote Originally Posted by nickrapak View Post
    The M3 and #5 don't have nearly the same light output. They have similar guide numbers, but if you look at the fine print, you'll see that the M3 is for a 3" reflector, and the #5 is for a 5" reflector. Basically, this means that with the tilt-a-mite (5" reflector), the M3s are actually a stop dimmer than their GN says, as evidenced by your test.
    That wasn't a test, that was just me trying to get some well lit photos. I have to say that if #5 weren't so annoyingly bright I would use them a lot more for outdoor night photography.
    "Would you like it if someone that painted in oils told you that you were not making portraits because you were using a camera?"
    "Shouldn't it be more about the joy of producing and viewing the photo than what you paid for the camera?"

    Me

  5. #35

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Shooter
    35mm RF
    Posts
    5

    Just going back to bulb flash after 50 years

    I am just going back to bulb flash after 50 years or so. My father's US agent sent me a Brownie Starflash in the early fifties which got me started but it was quite difficult to find the required Sylvania bulbs in the north of Scotland. I moved on to occasionally borrowing my father's Bilora to use with my Retina and Reid III cameras. However bulb flash went out the window when I was given a Mecablitz 102 as a Christmas present in about 1959.

    I have decided that bulb flash looks nicer with B&W film, as opposed to the Leica 24-D and 58-D flashes I use with my M8 and 9 cameras. I have recently found a near mint Leitz CEYOO to use with my IIF and M4 Leicas and I had hoped to use it with my Rolleiflex 3.5F Planar TLR as well but the PC lead will not fit, as it is the early shallow push on and turn Leica type. I have been lucky enough to locate a Rolleiflash, complete with ring, arm and reflector for just £12. I have a pair of SBC to small base adaptors and I am on the point of buying an SBC to PF adaptor.

    For bulbs, I am proposing to start with PF1 and PF5 for the Leica and M3 for the Rollei. I only really take B&W in film now, so not worried about blue bulbs. Any other suggestions as to good bulbs to start with (taking availability into account, remembering I am in Europe).

    I am probably going to replace the capacitor in both flashes. Someone has in the past replaced the Leica capacitor but it looks like some time ago and the soldering is of the splatter and hope variety. Amazon have axial wire 470 μf/35v capacitors but not the original 100 μf. Do folks think that the high value capacitor makes any difference other than taking slightly longer to charge after you put the bulb in.

    Below pics of the CEYOO and Rolleiflash

    Wilson
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails CEYOO.jpg   Rolleiflash.jpg  

  6. #36

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati Ohio USA
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    674
    First off as far as capacitors go they are not as needed as in the past. Decades ago the standard zinc-carbon battery held little total charge and had a short shelf life. So even when not in use they would get weak just sitting in the flash gun or in the unopened box on the store shelf.

    Several of the Kodak flash guns from the 50s could use regular AA batteries OR a 14 volt battery in combination with a capacitor. The capacitor just ensured that the flash went off if the battery was weak. Since 14 volt batteries are hard to come by today I just uses the AA batteries. With a fresh (unexpired) set of modern Lithium or Alkaline batteries I have never had a problem. Modern batteries are good for years on the shelf and setting a flash off only takes a very small part of their total charge. They should be good for 1,000 of flashes. With old style zinc-carbon batteries Kodak said to replace the batteries after only 100 flashes.

    Now I have a question. I have trouble in the USA finding Philips Style flash bulbs but M3 bulbs are common. In the UK is it easy to find M3 bulbs or are the Philips style bulbs more common?

  7. #37

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Shooter
    35mm RF
    Posts
    5

    Advantages of a capacitor

    One of the advantages of a flashgun with a capacitor is accuracy of firing. Now if you are using a camera at 1/30 sec, it is not too important but if you using say a Rolleiflex at 1/125 with a fast rise bulb, the flash needs to fire at exactly the correct time. The bulb gets such a whack of current with the capacitor, that it goes off instantly.

    You can find Philips PF1, PF1B and more rarely PF5, PF5B bulbs on UK Fleabay. The F in PF stands for "fast" not focal plane, therefore only useful for leaf shutter cameras, not Leicas or SLR's. PF1 has a guide number of about 40 and PF5 about 65. The blue bulbs about half this. My Leica IIFRD can just about use PF's at 1/30 because it has a unique feature. It has a small dial on top with settings of 1 to 20 which vary the delay between the shutter starting to open and the flash firing.

    There does on the face of it, appear to be one supplier in the UK, Marriottworld. However since the death of his wife, Stephanie last year, poor Fred Marriott is in such a state, that he has no idea of what stock he has and where to find it. I did not even get a reply to my last contact. All these second hand camera shops in the UK are closing down rapidly.

    I bought a rag bag of mixed bulbs (all BC base) from the nice guys at Pacific Rim Cameras. They probably have PF's if you need them. Bill Cress has them as well.

    Wilson

  8. #38

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati Ohio USA
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    674
    Concerned;
    I agree that a capacitor is very useful in with high speed bulbs or when flashbulbs are shot at high shutter speeds. My post was in reference to the cameras and flashes I use most often. I own over a 100 cameras. Most (but not all) of the ones I use flashbulbs with are old simple cameras from the 1940s, 50s and 60s. Theses cameras have slow shutter speeds of 1/60th of a second or less.

    Also to be clear to future readers of APUG. I have flash guns that can be used with OR WITHOUT a capacitor. Do not think you can cut a capacitor out of your flash gun and it will work unless you know what you are doing.

    As far as Marriottworld is concerned, I have know of Stephanie untimely passing for a year or so. She had a passion that her husband can not be expected to continue.

    I have over a 1,000 M3 and M3B flashbulbs in stock right now. If anyone on APUG would like to trade M3 (or other bulbs) for Phillips style bulbs PM me. That way we can do a trade and cut the ePRAY and PayPal (where is the pal ?) out of the equation.

  9. #39

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati Ohio USA
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    674
    Sirius Glass, you are smart and I have learned a lot from your posts in the past. We are both smart people. We just need to speak and we will respect each other. Let us not do this on a public forum trying to prove who is better. Neither of us is better. We are trying to post useful information. If you feel I am wrong let us not argue but come up with a proper post. Let us inform, NOT fight. PM me if you would like to talk and we could come up with a proper post that would be useful and informative to APUG.
    Last edited by brianmquinn; 05-19-2011 at 10:11 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  10. #40

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Shooter
    35mm RF
    Posts
    5
    For those who might not be sure how a capacitor flash gun circuit works, I post below the circuit diagram of my Leica CEYOO. When you plug in a flash bulb, it completes the outer circuit and a small current, limited by the 10K resistor to just 0.00225 amp (V=IR and assuming the resistance of the bulb is effectively nil compared to the 10K resistor), so the bulb does not fire. This current charges up the capacitor. So how long do you need to leave the bulb in for the capacitor to charge? If my maths is correct and I have remembered my electricity from physics 50 years ago, at 0.00225 amps, a 100 μf capacitor would require just 0.04 seconds to charge up. When the flash contact switch is closed, the battery is effectively out of circuit and it is the capacitor only which discharges rapidly through the flash bulb. The current rise rate of the capacitor would be much faster than a battery, particularly an old fashioned zinc carbon multi cell small battery, which was all that was available in the 1950's. If you have a leaky capacitor and leave a bulb in the flash, the battery will run down quite quickly, which is why it is always a good idea, if you are leaving a bulb in a flash for display purposes, take out the battery.

    I have now found a source for 100 μf axial wire capacitors and should have 2 waiting for me, when I get back to the UK next week.

    Wilson
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Screen shot 2011-05-20 at 08.34.46.png  

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin