John I'll try to take you seriously:
Originally Posted by jnanian
You run a group dedicated to Caffenol: what you are talking about MIGHT be of relevance over there.
In Scandinavia, the transfer to digital media have been more complete and irreversible than in USA and fr.instance Germany, there is (nearly) no vialble market for what we are talking about any longer over here.
We cannot get equipment repaired any longer.
We cannot buy anything but absolutely mainstream stuff any longer, that is especially true as far as chemicals and developing equipment goes.
They are laughing at us in store if we try to bring up anything about film equipment.
Between you, me and maybe the other TWO, TREE people in scandinavia that might be fool enough to import Ansco 130 themselves, I am the only person that know the formula, who have taken you so seriously that I looked it up, to give you an assessment. (I bet that sets you off on a frantic google-search to prove me wrong and finally get the formula, after having used it for so long!).
What you are talking about is totally irrelevant over here, because we cannot and will not be able to buy what you're talking of.
I still claim that your are developing your films in slightly fortified paper developer, and since you have repeatedly stated that you refrain from referring to what you do in anything that resembles a scientific language, what you are talking about is moot and irrelevant. We simply have no means to know prescisely what you are taling about, because noone, including you, know prescisely whats in your mix. You stick with oz, teaspoons nd tablespoons as a mean to tell others what you do. That makes it hard for others to know what in the hell you are talking about.
Developers and developing agents are about CONCENTRATION and pH. pH is also a metter of concentration. Now to know exactly what you are talking about, we need to know how many millilitres, how many grams per litre and what concentration exactly you are using. Knowing that it is possible to calculate, to try to asess whether it is worth the trouble to look into what you are talking about.
In that perspective, all your claims comes down as unsubstantiated claims only. So far I have seen nothing that makes me want to try to repeat anything of what you have done, it is simply not worth the trouble or work.
Before you came barging in, trying to hijack this diuscussion, this thread was very special, since all we have been talking about here have been prescise, reepeatable experiments that can be copied and verified by anyone. Until you entered the discussion.
We I can only speculate about why, but you have been talking elsewhere about people being "full of themselves". That reflects right back at yourself. Take your discussion with you back to your group, where you are free to moderate and lock out anyone that will not bend over to your skewed version of "caffenol".
As far as me goes what you are talking about is irrelevant. We are not concerned with comercially available developers, nor especially taken with "stand development techniques". My interest at least have been in chipping in, trying to take this seriously and beat the chaos of recipes and heresay about caffenol developers we find on the Net, especially in the USA, into a normal, dependable recipe that can be used and repeated by anyone all across the world.
Closing: Ansco developers are not available over here, nor will they ever be. It is even very hard to get even Kodak and Ilford chemicals.
The closest thing I can come up with, to what you are talking about, is using Rodinal, fortifying that with vitamin C and soda.
Guess what? If I take 30 ml of Rodinal, or even 15ml Rodinal, per tank of developer, it does not matter how much soda I put in there, nor how much vitamin C or coffee, instant or otherwise, because the concentration of commercially available Rodinal would be so strong, the pH so high, and developing agent concentration so high, that anything added would count for just a small percentile to what was there from the manufacturer........
In other words, as most have found out over the last one and a quarter century: it is very hard to improve on Rodinal, as it is with most commercially available developers that have survived the last century.
Last word: stick to an english group, since that google translation service you use makes your arguments look funny and nearly incomprehensible.