Tom I think democracy died many years ago. Remember when we would see a politicians face in the newspaper or on TV and would know who they were and what they stood for. Now a characterless face appears and no-one has the faintest idea of who they are or what party they represent.

I can't comment on Leica's as I just look in envy at the guy who's usually wearing it as a madalian to prove he can afford it

Andre I don't think Les will feel this is going too off topic (well I hope not and all threads do in the end).

You've got some valid points there and I do find it interesting that Karl Marx seems to have nailed many things that have happend in recent years in the Western world. Interesting considering the societies most of his work was based on.

In the UK we no longer have any distinct lines between parties and I'd go so far as to say that socialism doesn't even exist here except in tiny parties that have no chance of getting a seat anywhere. Sadly looking at the UK and Europe there is a worrying trend towards nationalism and even facism.